I heard Transporter Room .... :-)
I'm looking forward to see your lighting! Just yesterday I spend half the night converting my ancient Pike Era Transporter Room to Corona and had nearly too much fun with the lighting of the Transporter pads.
You really have like, zero faith in the ship's fire suppression system, don't you.
It's not that, but you need a backup in case they FAIL. Period. In one of my installments that hasn't widely been released yet (needs some adjustment) currently called ""Spellbound"" - you can read the rough copy here (https://sta.sh/01y422je1o9m) there is a scene where the fire suppression system DOES work during battle. Though in the one I'm working on now (called ""Act of Terror"" but may refer to it as ""The Great Terror"") does also have one time the fire suppression system works (after ""Ensign Jones"" gets his head blown off, BTW) and one time it doesn't work, when the Galaxy takes heavy damage and the fire suppression system on the bridge fails (and they DO use a fire extinguisher to put those fires out!).
I believe in backups too (and I've always loved the spacey TWOK extinguishers), but it's quite clear by the time of Generations and beyond that Starfleet as a whole is secure enough in the reliability of said Automated Suppression Systems (which by TNG would come in multiple redundant forms ie chemicals, CO2, and containment fields), that smaller manual units can be happily relegated to storage compartments - along with a couple of fire blankets and the requisite medical kits
The sheer weight of the onscreen evidence for that doesn't exactly work in your favor.
Sigh... Internet kept coming and going. I got some references for the transporter but if I can't just search for something at any time while working, progress would be painfully slow. It's been stable today so far, but just to avoid more frustration, I started with the ""no reference required"" bits on the Galaxy's new battle bridge. The conn/ops area has been widened, and the ceiling replaced by a Brattain/Zodiac-style piece.
A lot of stuff's still in progress of course, all the old TMP era lables will be replaced with the blue TNG style ones, colors might get changed, and the railing will probably be replaced by the style we saw on the Enterprise-C.
For all my finished Trek fan art, please visit my portfolio
Looks good so far, but FWIW I'd recommend some adjustments to help keep it in the ""TNG era with a decent budget"":
1) Try the original Battle Bridge lighting strips under the consoles, to tie it with the original and also escape the ""Excelsior set recycling"" look of the existing ones (or maybe just frame them thickly with the medium grey elsewhere on the bridge, so the light panels are leaner?)
2) Nix the octagonal ceiling fitting - maybe try a circular one with the same cross-section - as this one frankly always looked a bit cheap onscreen.
3) For the same reason, I'd say definitely avoid the Ent-C railings. How about the ""EAF"" extra lower railings added to the current rails, and painting the top handrail in turquoise?
4) Nix the old-style turbolift controls. One could argue they were used on the Ent-E, but frankly that entire bridge was an exercise in belt-tightening hitting production design, and it looked a mess as a result - it'd be wise to avoid repeating it.
5) Amend the viewscreen area to reproduce the elements used on both the original and S4 TNG Battle Bridge, to again avoid the ""recycled movie stock"" look and keep it suited to the era.
They're just ideas of course, but personally I'd be wary of having it look too Recycled Movie-Era. The shows fell into that trap because of budget; you don't necessarily have to. :thumb:
ETA: The inverted carpet arrangement from the Belknap really works well, I love it!
I myself don't really have a problem with some of the movie-era elements remaining. I guess that's mostly because many TNG Enterprise-D sets got reused for the Enterprise-A in TFF/TUC. I never really though the octogonal thing looked THAT cheap though. Originally it was a ceiling fixture for the Malcorian hospital room that Riker was taken to in the 4th season episode ""First Contact"" (NOT the movie!), without that red thing in the middle of it. However, could you make the outer lights blue like seen in the ""First Contact"" episode?
One thing I did ask for the viewer though was a flasher on top shaped like that housing that had the digital clocks above the viewer on the Ent-A and Excelsior bridges in TUC. Perhaps some LCARS displays on both sides of the viewer could help too.
I do think the Conn/Ops/Tactical/Security/Emergency Manual Override stations should be a lighter gray (but still a dark gray), sort of an in-between to the non-lighted support pylons and that outer area of the upper display units.
My original idea, actually, was that the tactical and security stations be moved forward and those sections of the railings be eliminated. They would have ""wireframe"" stands like those consoles on the Saratoga in the DS9 pilot episode ""Emissary,"" as would the Emergency Manual Override console. However, if you folks despite the idea, I will *NOT* ask Rekkert to do that. I do take some input here.
I've made the stations a lighter gray as suggested. I went for the same material I used on the Constellation consoles/walls, rather than the grey I'm using on this bridge's walls, which is taken from the Galaxy. The reason is not only the different shade, but also the roughness and texture of the materials. The material from the Galaxy has a very thin layer of grain, similar to the one used on the Enterprise-D and ships of that era; while the Constellation has a much thicker layer, which reflects light in a much more interesting fashion, like the consoles on the Enterprise-B did.
Regarding the railings, I realized two things:
-First, the middle one wasn't really needed, as the extended conn/ops platform makes that area a simple step that officers can use to take their stations.
-Second, the Enterprise-C style of handrail can be combined with the Saratoga style of strut to make them fit in better with the rest of the bridge. That way it's not a simple reuse of the TMP railing, plus it keeps the straight lines of the Enterprise-C handrails (which when looked from a top view, combine perfectly with the straight lines of the TNG consoles) without looking like cheap set dressing.
For all my finished Trek fan art, please visit my portfolio
The blue tint on the lighting definitely works to make the set appropriately moody, I like it! The handrails too are a clear improvement over the Ent-C ones! :thumb:
I agree the consoles look much better in the lighter grey, though they do make the remaining darker elements look a little out of place in comparison, IMO.
Re: the console wire stands, I think the angular support struts looked better, personally (The steel supports always scream ""old ship got a refit!"" to me ).
@Rusty0918 the sets being recycled for TUC weren't so bad where they were sufficiently redressed (eg the corridors and xporter room), or only seen minimally so as to be easy to ignore (sickbay!), but I think most people try to completely forget about the more glaring instances of cheap reuses, such as Engineering and the TNG Officers' Quarters. FWIW, Falke2009 over on DeviantArt often manages to avoid this issue effectively, with his Miranda-class and Nova-class interiors in particular developed to avoid the more troublesome budget-induced anachronisms.
Those padded lower parts to the wall consoles seems far more Enterprise A than it does the C or early D. Perhaps the panels at the bottom of the corridor from this TNG episode could be an idea for replacing the padded elements. interface074.jpg thepegasus217.jpgthepegasus250.jpg
I was thinking about what Starscream said and I do see some changes that could be done.
That thingamajig that has the red alert flasher above the viewer can be the same type of thingamajig that is above the viewer on Rekkert's Galatea bridge as well as the thingamajig below the viewer (but not overlapping the chaser light strip). I was thinking the chaser lights below the viewer should be TFF Enterprise-A/GEN Enterprise-B style.
IMO the Saratoga bits are perfect for a battle bridge, as they look a lot more functional and austere than the more elegant stands used on the Enterprise-D. However given the bits taken from the Saratoga and Brattain (both Mirandas), and the TMP style of the bridge with those padded areas under the consoles, I feel like this bridge could very easily be a 24th century bridge for a TMP design, like a Miranda or Excelsior. Maybe the lower parts of the consoles could be replaced by access panels, like the ones the Enterprise-C had? This would go a long way in making it look like a bridge built in the 2360's, even if based in an earlier design.
Most of the LCARS are now in place, plus nearly all of the TMP era labels have been replaced by the TNG era ones.
For all my finished Trek fan art, please visit my portfolio
I think I'd like to keep the lower parts of those parameter stations as is. The lights underneath gives the bridge a dramatic flair to it that it wouldn't have it was removed.
I was thinking the forward Emergency Manual Override console should have one of those ""boxier"" stands that was first seen on the Brattain bridge which was later used throughout TNG on various other sets (cargo bays, shuttlebays, the torpedo bay) as well as on other guest bridges.
Agreed, that looks really odd against the curve of the deck. Maybe if it'd been curved to match all along, it could've worked with the solid base...
e
I agree with @Rusty0918 on that the lower lights need to be there, but it's the style that looks out of place. I'd advocate at least having the light strips set into a grey frame so that the lit areas look leaner (maybe even the same thickness as the buttress lights?), and have a more unique appearance.
Other than that, the modelling is awesome as ever, but try as I might I can't suspend disbelief that it's supposed to be a late C24th bridge - the anachronistic elements are just too numerous and overt. *shrug*
@Starscream - the gray frame idea may work. I did give Rekkert a few ideas of what to put above and below the viewer (elements from his Galatea bridge).
I don't want that emergency override console to be curved, but perhaps it can be moved back a bit from the edge.
As with the stands for the standing consoles (and perhaps the railings stubs themselves) - perhaps have a stand that is based off of a playground parallel bar like this:
Note - a SINGLE parallel bar, not both of 'em. And of course made them thicker. Place the console on top of the bar.
I really like that take on the Battle Bridge... it actually also has a lot of touches that make me think of the Runabout, which is perfect! I could also see this being the bridge on a micro-ship, scout ships, science vessels, that sort of thing.
Yeah, just as with the Constellation bridge itself, I'm getting all sort of ideas of how to turn this into the bridge of the TNG era Excelsior-Class Potemkin, the Centaur, a lot of ships with origins in the TMP era hahaha.
Maybe replacing the light below the consoles with a thinner, extruded design, like the one the early TNG battle bridge (and thus also the early Galaxy battle bridge) had?
Anyway, I've added the MSD style graphic on the back of the bridge, for the general status console; plus the little fabric access panels at the back. I've also replaced the fabric material on the walls with the same one used on the main bridge, to tie them together a bit more.
Plus, I have added the little bit on top of the viewscreen from the earlier battle bridge (it works a bit better there than the one from the Galatea IMO), however I'm having a hard time adding the bottom section. Because of the bigger viewscreen and the blinkies at the bottom, it's really hard to fit something in that area (not to mention that the manual override station blocks the view of anything placed there anyway)
In other news, Scragnog released another video! This one's a modified version of the Quasar Two Three Fore lounge. We had been working on adapting the lounge for usage in Stage 9, serving as a new starting area for the players. You'd start on the lounge, which would be located inside the 'arm' of a drydock, and from there you could transport yourself (or take a shuttle) to the Enterprise. This would've given players a better first impression of the ship, seeing it though those windows (which would've been enlarged somewhat); and a grand entrance, TMP style, if they chose to go with the shuttle.
Alas, we didn't get to do all that, which probably would've required a couple more versions to be ready. Still, here's the remnants of that idea, with the lounge now located in a drydock style structure.
For all my finished Trek fan art, please visit my portfolio
@Rekkert exactly what I was thinking for the lower lights - it'd tie it nicely to the original Battle Bridge set, and if they're similar thickness to the buttress light then there's a nice element of continuity there, too
The new MSD and the padded access panels look great!
The upper black alert strip above the viewscreen is a bit redundant now that the "blinky box" is there IMO, as you'd have two red alert flashers (the box itself looks great). To be honest I think you'd also have a better looking setup if you installed the lower blinky add-on (or a version thereof) after all, and then split up the original lower black strip into two smaller LCARS controls to either side of the box... It'd make it look very clean and "TNG" overall, that way...
@Rusty0918 great idea on the new supports! The curved edges and overall thickness would scream "TNG" Might be an idea to have them lean inwards towards the centre of the bridge slightly, as the original supports did. Would you be having them in a dark metal grey ala the Main Bridge horseshoe?
Re: the new video, it's nice to see but the lighting is looking really odd... Seems like the lights are set at too high an intensity, but with too rapid a falloff? Other than that, it reminded me that the upper level of 2-3-Fore around the windows woukd be ideal to convert into the Ent-D's forward observation lounge, that Picard was seen ogling out of in early S1 (which they had to redress the Conference Lounge for).
Right, that's enough from me for one year ("thank goodness" I hear you say )! Have a great night everyone; I'll see you in 2019 :thumb:
@Starscream - glad you agree about the supports, though I don't want 'em curving in slightly. And I do agree that the upper alert strip is redundant above the "blinky box" is redundant, but perhaps the lower box can have some LCARS instead of it being blank.
@Rekkert - You want to to be a TNG-style Excelsior bridge eh? In the installment I'm working on - "Act of Terror," there is an Excelsior-class starship in it, though at the moment I have it having the older style TMP okudagrams. FYI - the ship name is USS Endeavour and the registry is NCC-38906 (it precedes the one that's mentioned in TNG - it gets trashed in the story).
As with the lighting, we could go with the thinner extruded style.
Time to resurrect this old thread from the ages ago that was 2018...
Considering the new blinky box added, I can simply remove the older style alert strip at the top. I haven't added the new console supports yet, but I've done the extruded lights on some of the consoles as a test.
I've also added the buttresses of the earlier battle bridge in, with some modifications to fit in with the new diameter of the bridge. This was kinda an accident as when I copied over some of the models from the 2360 battle bridge to check the lights, the buttresses were also copied and I kinda liked how they looked, again making the bridge a bit more grounded on the 24th Century IMO. As ever though, Rusty it's your design, so let me know what you think.
For all my finished Trek fan art, please visit my portfolio
Good call on the buttresses - let's leave those in. Furthermore, you can remove that red alert strip above that "box" thingamagic above the viewer.
I think let's change those base light panels below the parameter stations to the way they were. Although perhaps add the ""ribbed"" lighting effect like you had on the Constellation.
Okey, here are some ideas, placed just on one of the consoles as tests. As you can see, for all of them I've made the edges of the light a bit curved, which gives it a better ground on the TNG aesthetic rather than the angled fixtures of TMP.
First it's Starscream's:
Second idea, emulating the pattern seen on vertical lights all over the Enterprise during TNG:
And thirdly, a mix of both, with the lines closer together but going from end to end:
Thoughts on all this?
For all my finished Trek fan art, please visit my portfolio
Posts
I'm looking forward to see your lighting! Just yesterday I spend half the night converting my ancient Pike Era Transporter Room to Corona and had nearly too much fun with the lighting of the Transporter pads.
It's not that, but you need a backup in case they FAIL. Period. In one of my installments that hasn't widely been released yet (needs some adjustment) currently called ""Spellbound"" - you can read the rough copy here (https://sta.sh/01y422je1o9m) there is a scene where the fire suppression system DOES work during battle. Though in the one I'm working on now (called ""Act of Terror"" but may refer to it as ""The Great Terror"") does also have one time the fire suppression system works (after ""Ensign Jones"" gets his head blown off, BTW) and one time it doesn't work, when the Galaxy takes heavy damage and the fire suppression system on the bridge fails (and they DO use a fire extinguisher to put those fires out!).
The sheer weight of the onscreen evidence for that doesn't exactly work in your favor.
A lot of stuff's still in progress of course, all the old TMP era lables will be replaced with the blue TNG style ones, colors might get changed, and the railing will probably be replaced by the style we saw on the Enterprise-C.
1) Try the original Battle Bridge lighting strips under the consoles, to tie it with the original and also escape the ""Excelsior set recycling"" look of the existing ones (or maybe just frame them thickly with the medium grey elsewhere on the bridge, so the light panels are leaner?)
2) Nix the octagonal ceiling fitting - maybe try a circular one with the same cross-section - as this one frankly always looked a bit cheap onscreen.
3) For the same reason, I'd say definitely avoid the Ent-C railings. How about the ""EAF"" extra lower railings added to the current rails, and painting the top handrail in turquoise?
4) Nix the old-style turbolift controls. One could argue they were used on the Ent-E, but frankly that entire bridge was an exercise in belt-tightening hitting production design, and it looked a mess as a result - it'd be wise to avoid repeating it.
5) Amend the viewscreen area to reproduce the elements used on both the original and S4 TNG Battle Bridge, to again avoid the ""recycled movie stock"" look and keep it suited to the era.
They're just ideas of course, but personally I'd be wary of having it look too Recycled Movie-Era. The shows fell into that trap because of budget; you don't necessarily have to. :thumb:
ETA: The inverted carpet arrangement from the Belknap really works well, I love it!
One thing I did ask for the viewer though was a flasher on top shaped like that housing that had the digital clocks above the viewer on the Ent-A and Excelsior bridges in TUC. Perhaps some LCARS displays on both sides of the viewer could help too.
I do think the Conn/Ops/Tactical/Security/Emergency Manual Override stations should be a lighter gray (but still a dark gray), sort of an in-between to the non-lighted support pylons and that outer area of the upper display units.
My original idea, actually, was that the tactical and security stations be moved forward and those sections of the railings be eliminated. They would have ""wireframe"" stands like those consoles on the Saratoga in the DS9 pilot episode ""Emissary,"" as would the Emergency Manual Override console. However, if you folks despite the idea, I will *NOT* ask Rekkert to do that.
I've changed the ceiling lights as suggested, it's certainly different, but I do like the combination. It corresponds with the ceiling lighting seen on the Ent-D battle bridge.
I've made the stations a lighter gray as suggested. I went for the same material I used on the Constellation consoles/walls, rather than the grey I'm using on this bridge's walls, which is taken from the Galaxy. The reason is not only the different shade, but also the roughness and texture of the materials. The material from the Galaxy has a very thin layer of grain, similar to the one used on the Enterprise-D and ships of that era; while the Constellation has a much thicker layer, which reflects light in a much more interesting fashion, like the consoles on the Enterprise-B did.
Regarding the railings, I realized two things:
-First, the middle one wasn't really needed, as the extended conn/ops platform makes that area a simple step that officers can use to take their stations.
-Second, the Enterprise-C style of handrail can be combined with the Saratoga style of strut to make them fit in better with the rest of the bridge. That way it's not a simple reuse of the TMP railing, plus it keeps the straight lines of the Enterprise-C handrails (which when looked from a top view, combine perfectly with the straight lines of the TNG consoles) without looking like cheap set dressing.
I agree the consoles look much better in the lighter grey, though they do make the remaining darker elements look a little out of place in comparison, IMO.
Re: the console wire stands, I think the angular support struts looked better, personally (The steel supports always scream ""old ship got a refit!"" to me
@Rusty0918 the sets being recycled for TUC weren't so bad where they were sufficiently redressed (eg the corridors and xporter room), or only seen minimally so as to be easy to ignore (sickbay!), but I think most people try to completely forget about the more glaring instances of cheap reuses, such as Engineering and the TNG Officers' Quarters.
interface074.jpg
thepegasus217.jpgthepegasus250.jpg
That thingamajig that has the red alert flasher above the viewer can be the same type of thingamajig that is above the viewer on Rekkert's Galatea bridge as well as the thingamajig below the viewer (but not overlapping the chaser light strip). I was thinking the chaser lights below the viewer should be TFF Enterprise-A/GEN Enterprise-B style.
Most of the LCARS are now in place, plus nearly all of the TMP era labels have been replaced by the TNG era ones.
I was thinking the forward Emergency Manual Override console should have one of those ""boxier"" stands that was first seen on the Brattain bridge which was later used throughout TNG on various other sets (cargo bays, shuttlebays, the torpedo bay) as well as on other guest bridges.
e
I agree with @Rusty0918 on that the lower lights need to be there, but it's the style that looks out of place. I'd advocate at least having the light strips set into a grey frame so that the lit areas look leaner (maybe even the same thickness as the buttress lights?), and have a more unique appearance.
Other than that, the modelling is awesome as ever, but try as I might I can't suspend disbelief that it's supposed to be a late C24th bridge - the anachronistic elements are just too numerous and overt. *shrug*
I don't want that emergency override console to be curved, but perhaps it can be moved back a bit from the edge.
As with the stands for the standing consoles (and perhaps the railings stubs themselves) - perhaps have a stand that is based off of a playground parallel bar like this:
Note - a SINGLE parallel bar, not both of 'em. And of course made them thicker. Place the console on top of the bar.
Would that work?
Maybe replacing the light below the consoles with a thinner, extruded design, like the one the early TNG battle bridge (and thus also the early Galaxy battle bridge) had?
Anyway, I've added the MSD style graphic on the back of the bridge, for the general status console; plus the little fabric access panels at the back. I've also replaced the fabric material on the walls with the same one used on the main bridge, to tie them together a bit more.
Plus, I have added the little bit on top of the viewscreen from the earlier battle bridge (it works a bit better there than the one from the Galatea IMO), however I'm having a hard time adding the bottom section. Because of the bigger viewscreen and the blinkies at the bottom, it's really hard to fit something in that area (not to mention that the manual override station blocks the view of anything placed there anyway)
In other news, Scragnog released another video! This one's a modified version of the Quasar Two Three Fore lounge. We had been working on adapting the lounge for usage in Stage 9, serving as a new starting area for the players. You'd start on the lounge, which would be located inside the 'arm' of a drydock, and from there you could transport yourself (or take a shuttle) to the Enterprise. This would've given players a better first impression of the ship, seeing it though those windows (which would've been enlarged somewhat); and a grand entrance, TMP style, if they chose to go with the shuttle.
Alas, we didn't get to do all that, which probably would've required a couple more versions to be ready. Still, here's the remnants of that idea, with the lounge now located in a drydock style structure.
The new MSD and the padded access panels look great!
The upper black alert strip above the viewscreen is a bit redundant now that the "blinky box" is there IMO, as you'd have two red alert flashers (the box itself looks great). To be honest I think you'd also have a better looking setup if you installed the lower blinky add-on (or a version thereof) after all, and then split up the original lower black strip into two smaller LCARS controls to either side of the box... It'd make it look very clean and "TNG" overall, that way...
@Rusty0918 great idea on the new supports! The curved edges and overall thickness would scream "TNG"
Re: the new video, it's nice to see but the lighting is looking really odd... Seems like the lights are set at too high an intensity, but with too rapid a falloff? Other than that, it reminded me that the upper level of 2-3-Fore around the windows woukd be ideal to convert into the Ent-D's forward observation lounge, that Picard was seen ogling out of in early S1 (which they had to redress the Conference Lounge for).
Right, that's enough from me for one year ("thank goodness" I hear you say
@Rekkert - You want to to be a TNG-style Excelsior bridge eh? In the installment I'm working on - "Act of Terror," there is an Excelsior-class starship in it, though at the moment I have it having the older style TMP okudagrams. FYI - the ship name is USS Endeavour and the registry is NCC-38906 (it precedes the one that's mentioned in TNG - it gets trashed in the story).
As with the lighting, we could go with the thinner extruded style.
Considering the new blinky box added, I can simply remove the older style alert strip at the top. I haven't added the new console supports yet, but I've done the extruded lights on some of the consoles as a test.
I've also added the buttresses of the earlier battle bridge in, with some modifications to fit in with the new diameter of the bridge. This was kinda an accident as when I copied over some of the models from the 2360 battle bridge to check the lights, the buttresses were also copied and I kinda liked how they looked, again making the bridge a bit more grounded on the 24th Century IMO. As ever though, Rusty it's your design, so let me know what you think.
I think let's change those base light panels below the parameter stations to the way they were. Although perhaps add the ""ribbed"" lighting effect like you had on the Constellation.
How about putting a single grey strip through the middle of the Excelsior panels, like so?
___________________
___________________
___________________
That way you keep it unique, and a bit cleaner and sleeker looking than the old grills.
It's funny how well those old buttresses work with the general bridge!
Okey, here's the Constellation style ligh... oh...
Goes back inside
First it's Starscream's:
Second idea, emulating the pattern seen on vertical lights all over the Enterprise during TNG:
And thirdly, a mix of both, with the lines closer together but going from end to end:
Thoughts on all this?