well just remember.. deck height doesn't need to be consistent.. even on the Ent D, the saucer decks were 4 meters, while the eng hull decks were 3.5m shuttle decks are also weird.. most of us try to keep it consistent, but I know that I usually just get it in the ball park most of the time, and only correct egregious errors... cuz most of the time i build off plans..
and your not the only one that builds off an engineering point of view, I think of myself as more of an archetect building things
@evil_genius_180 - Yeah man! The canon bridge always bothered me too, hehe. It's funny, I started this thing looking at it as an artist, then as more of an engineer once I got into the details. It's like you want to make it look right, but you also want things to fit reasonably.
They have that problem on a lot of ships. The problem is, the TMP set, on which the battle bridge set is built, is what they used for their random ship bridges (as well as other random interiors.) However, they were constantly setting it up and tearing it down, so it often didn't match the ship's exterior. (the Stargazer is a great example of this, along with the Ent-C) Of course, that's not the only thing that bothers me about that bridge. There are only 3 chairs on the whole thing. So, it sucks to be you if you're not the captain, helm or tactical. Though, it also sucks to be the captain. There's a stand-up console in front of the helm/tactical stations, so there crewperson there is blocking your view of the viewscreen.
MY only suggestion with the bridge is dont round it. I was looking over this a while ago, and if the E-C is a transition between the Excelsior/B (Round layout with side consoles) and the D (ovaloid layout - side consoles) then to be a true lineage upgrade for that era, it should technically by ovaloid as well, (or beginning to) and with fewer consoles on the sides of hte bridge, maybe the first bridge that would actively have doors to other rooms like the obs lounge and ready room. Does that make sense?
@TALON_UK - *highfive* Thanks, man! I kinda slogged along for a bit last month, but I think I can see the finish line now.
@VALKYRIE013 - I can dig that, and yeah I'm still struck by the level of thought and detail that goes into these ships sometimes! And you have a good point on deck height. I think designers would never get the models finished if they worried about stuff like that too much. Fortunately, I'll know what to expect and be able to cut them efficiently on the next project.
@evil_genius_180 - Agreed, I kept the basic setup with the flanking consoles, but I felt compelled to make better use of the space, and have enough room for people to sit and still be able to get around. I also figured that there needed to be more of an intermediate step between TMP era and TNG, so I abandoned the majority of the TMP era structure and detailing. Also, if there were going to be adjoining rooms within the superstructure, it makes sense for the walls of the bridge to be vertical. So now I not only have a somewhat bigger bridge, but also more space for the other rooms.
And the more I look at the three-seat, canon setup, the more absurd it becomes. The red shirt at that front console would be the first to die every episode xD
@Nadesico - I'm with you there; the walls are designed to taper in towards the viewscreen, freeing up space for waiting areas, stairs, ready room, etc. Also, in moving towards the Galaxy class config, nearly all of the operating consoles are aft, where there's more room. Plus, it's easier to access all the stations from the turbolifts.
@publiusr - Thanks! I scooped those free apps up for sure. Haven't tried Nanocad yet, though
Still getting the textures together and whatnot, but I'm almost done with the bridge. I'll work on the waiting area with the stairs and the ready room after that, but probably won't detail those too much. I also got bored over the weekend and put a shuttle together. Seemed logical to go with what they used in Generations, I think. I don't have any good references for the greeble on the bottom, so I'll have to improvise. I've always been fascinated by shuttle designs and probably should do a thread on those at some point. We'll see...
I'm learning a great deal about how this stuff is done, between the hours of modeling, gawking at model photos, and the threads and comments on this forum
Mhmm... looking at the secondary hull and the way you cut the grid lines in, I don't think you did your model too much of a favour by cutting along the mesh's geometry lines - it brakes up the smoothness of the surface and gives the hull a rather segmented look.
Excellent work on that bridge, you've come up with a very good mix of the Galaxy class and more TMP style bridge configurations there, gives it a very plausable missing link feel between the two eras.
Loving that shuttle, but isn't that the model from ST5? Definitely looks more like that than a TNG model, especially with those TMP style nacelles. Though now that I think about it I think that model of shuttle only had a front window and didn't have additional windows either side. Great looking mesh either way.
That's my favorite style of shuttle from all of Star Trek. I even like it better than the modified version they started using in season 5 of TNG.
The bridge looks awesome so far.
Yeah man! It's my favorite too. I always thought the type 6 was a bit too compact to be very functional. I was fascinated by the ST:V shuttle and always thought it should have windows to fill the negative space on the sides, so I was happy when I saw the shots of it from Generations.
Mhmm... looking at the secondary hull and the way you cut the grid lines in, I don't think you did your model too much of a favour by cutting along the mesh's geometry lines - it brakes up the smoothness of the surface and gives the hull a rather segmented look.
I'm glad you mentioned that. I was half-expecting the Ambassador's grid lines to be straight horizontal/vertical in the beginning, like the other ships. But in this case, they actually contour the hull along the same lines of the geometry, so it wasn't really a conscious choice. I'll take to it again to figure out a way to fix it, but it'll probably be a little while before I do.
Excellent work on that bridge, you've come up with a very good mix of the Galaxy class and more TMP style bridge configurations there, gives it a very plausable missing link feel between the two eras.
Loving that shuttle, but isn't that the model from ST5? Definitely looks more like that than a TNG model, especially with those TMP style nacelles. Though now that I think about it I think that model of shuttle only had a front window and didn't have additional windows either side. Great looking mesh either way.
It took me a while to find a balance between the two bridge styles, but I'm glad it seems to work. The shuttle was an obscure redress of the ST:V shuttle that they used in a scene from Generations. The updates they made to it seemed to fit between the old one and the type 6 they used in TNG season 5. We'll see how she looks in the shuttlebay interior once it's shaped up. http://images.wikia.com/memoryalpha/en/images/b/be/Hawking,_shuttlecraft,_delete_scene.jpg
I agree, the battle bridge is awesome. I don't like it quite as well as the TOS or TMP bridge (even though it was built on the TMP set) but it's cool. I like how functional it is. The ship bridges from that era seem to have a lot of wasted space, especially the main bridge of the Enterprise-D and Voyager. The battle bridge had no wasted space. It had the stations necessary to get the job done.
Yeah man! It's my favorite too. I always thought the type 6 was a bit too compact to be very functional. I was fascinated by the ST:V shuttle and always thought it should have windows to fill the negative space on the sides, so I was happy when I saw the shots of it from Generations.
Yeah, I love the STV shuttle redress in Generations. They even redressed the surviving full-sized mock-up (the other was cut down and modified for the type-6.) Too bad the scene of it landing was cut from the film. The type-6 was good for its time. It was the smaller shuttle, it was usually used to transport 1-4 people. It's good for that. For bigger jobs, they had the type-7. Too bad the full-sized type-7 looked so hideous, or they'd have never had to create the type-6.
That bridge is VERY well designed, with one caveat: how do you get into those chairs? ;-) Add a bit of a jog to the platform they're on (see the Final Frontier bridge for an example) so the step doesn't come right up to the base of the chair and those poor officers won't have to leap into their seats. ;-)
^ Gotta say I miss your Ambassador bridge design, SeanR. Not to impinge on this one, as it's pretty solid looking; but your take was in IMHO the best representation of an intermediate step between the Enterprises -B and -D out there.
(don't suppose you'd like to go back and finish it would you? )
And where might we find SeanR's take on this please, I'd like to compare and drool over what I expect to be awesome work (which is all that I see on this forum!).
Nice to see the Generations shuttle built. It's a pity it only occurred to them to convert the other TFF shuttle once the series was over, as it would've been pretty cool to have that and the Type-6 side by side in the shuttlebay. Perfect for this period, though.
Nice to see the Generations shuttle built. It's a pity it only occurred to them to convert the other TFF shuttle once the series was over, as it would've been pretty cool to have that and the Type-6 side by side in the shuttlebay. Perfect for this period, though.
It was probably one of those things where they wanted to have different models of shuttles and someone was poking around a warehouse, found that one and said, "Hey..."
I agree, it would have been cool to see it on the series. However, you also have to consider the series budget. While it was cheaper to modify the model than to build a new one, it still cost money. Also, that would have been another thing for them to keep and maintain and move in and out as the set was built and torn down/modified.
True, I think the shuttlebay stage doubled up as the planet of the week, so having one more (even bigger) shuttle would have been a pain. It's a pity there's no TNG era Trek being produced around now or I'm sure we'd see expansive views of the entire main shuttlebay... *sigh*
@Seanr Good point, bro! I'll reshape that platform as soon as I get back to finishing the bridge.
Business has picked up, so I haven't been able to focus as much on this recently. That said, this isn't much of an update, but I made some quick adjustments to the bridge lighting and shaped the viewscreen out. Still tons of work left to do (better textures and UV mapping, mostly), as well as the rest of the seating to add and the side rooms.
I did manage to get the shuttle completely textured though. Not sure if I'm going to build the interior for this one...
And to Pearse's point, I would've liked to have seen the full main shuttlebay on TNG as well, so I boxed one out at proper scale for this ship.
Awesome stuff. Great work on the shuttle and it looks right at home in that bay. I love that bridge too. Not a lot of wasted space. It's almost... cozy, but it has that huge awesome view screen.
I realize it's not finished, but are you planning on refining that area where the rim around the upper bulkhead meets the viewer wall? It just looks a little off where it plows into the wall without meeting up with the ceiling light frames.
Thanks, man! Oh yeah, other than the crude shuttlebay, I haven't done much modeling on this file since the previous post, but I do want to have seats on those side consoles and the engineering alcove in the back. Kinda bothers me when there aren't any seats on the bridge of what's supposed to be a long range, deep space vessel :P
@ Basill - Yeah, man. I figure if we're going to have a viewscreen, let's not have one where people need to squint!
And yeah, I do plan on doing something else with that part of the structure. I can't really find good established references for that area, so I'll probably do some sketching to see what looks good. I've had to revert to backups of the larger model body, so I may have to turn the focus back to finishing the space-frame of the ship for a little bit... -_-
Yeah, I hated that we never got to see the main shuttlebay, beyond the miniature they constructed for Cause and Effect. (complete with tiny shuttles) But, I'm sure that was a financial decision. The smaller bays could be put together more quickly and less expensively using their multipurpose sets. So, it's nice to see you're building one. That looks good so far. The bridge still looks fantastic, even if there are a few flaws. (but, as Sean pointed out, some of those flaws are present in some of the bridge sets too)
Indeed, I think that's why it's so fulfilling to be able to build these things without having to worry about building costs!
As for the bridge and the other interior sets, I'm leaning towards stepping back and getting the sketchbook out to get a better feel for how they all need to look. Hopefully, that will keep me from rebuilding them into oblivion :P
Great to see the shuttle hanging out with its friends in the bay. I was wondering about that side wall of the bridge as well. I think if you change the margin around the pillowing on the curvy bit and the top so it matches the left hand side it should all look pretty natural. It's either that or switching it out for an alcove the same as the turbolift and aft stations have.
Hey thanks! It's been harder to get the concept right than actually building it at this point.
@Pearse - Those are both good suggestions Before I spent any more time modeling this thing, I wanted to get this thing tightened up. I did a quick sketch (Please excuse the off perspective. <_<) of what it would look like with the alcove arrangement like you said. I think the extra room at the front of the bridge will split the smaller rooms in the super structure up, but I'm fine with that if it works.
I thinking about removing the platforms, lowering helm/conn stations to the floor. Also, the tactical station behind the captain's chair will have two seats, as well as the flanking communications/science stations.
Posts
and your not the only one that builds off an engineering point of view, I think of myself as more of an archetect building things
Its looking awesome sir! keep it up!
They have that problem on a lot of ships. The problem is, the TMP set, on which the battle bridge set is built, is what they used for their random ship bridges (as well as other random interiors.) However, they were constantly setting it up and tearing it down, so it often didn't match the ship's exterior. (the Stargazer is a great example of this, along with the Ent-C) Of course, that's not the only thing that bothers me about that bridge. There are only 3 chairs on the whole thing. So, it sucks to be you if you're not the captain, helm or tactical. Though, it also sucks to be the captain. There's a stand-up console in front of the helm/tactical stations, so there crewperson there is blocking your view of the viewscreen.
Current Projects:
Ambassador Class
Misc resources
http://nanocad.com/
https://www.daz3d.com/i/3d/free-3d-software-overview?home_f_btn=start
@VALKYRIE013 - I can dig that, and yeah I'm still struck by the level of thought and detail that goes into these ships sometimes! And you have a good point on deck height. I think designers would never get the models finished if they worried about stuff like that too much. Fortunately, I'll know what to expect and be able to cut them efficiently on the next project.
@evil_genius_180 - Agreed, I kept the basic setup with the flanking consoles, but I felt compelled to make better use of the space, and have enough room for people to sit and still be able to get around. I also figured that there needed to be more of an intermediate step between TMP era and TNG, so I abandoned the majority of the TMP era structure and detailing. Also, if there were going to be adjoining rooms within the superstructure, it makes sense for the walls of the bridge to be vertical. So now I not only have a somewhat bigger bridge, but also more space for the other rooms.
And the more I look at the three-seat, canon setup, the more absurd it becomes. The red shirt at that front console would be the first to die every episode xD
@Nadesico - I'm with you there; the walls are designed to taper in towards the viewscreen, freeing up space for waiting areas, stairs, ready room, etc. Also, in moving towards the Galaxy class config, nearly all of the operating consoles are aft, where there's more room. Plus, it's easier to access all the stations from the turbolifts.
@publiusr - Thanks! I scooped those free apps up for sure.
Still getting the textures together and whatnot, but I'm almost done with the bridge. I'll work on the waiting area with the stairs and the ready room after that, but probably won't detail those too much. I also got bored over the weekend and put a shuttle together. Seemed logical to go with what they used in Generations, I think. I don't have any good references for the greeble on the bottom, so I'll have to improvise. I've always been fascinated by shuttle designs and probably should do a thread on those at some point. We'll see...
I'm learning a great deal about how this stuff is done, between the hours of modeling, gawking at model photos, and the threads and comments on this forum
The bridge looks awesome so far.
Loving that shuttle, but isn't that the model from ST5? Definitely looks more like that than a TNG model, especially with those TMP style nacelles. Though now that I think about it I think that model of shuttle only had a front window and didn't have additional windows either side. Great looking mesh either way.
Yeah man! It's my favorite too.
I'm glad you mentioned that. I was half-expecting the Ambassador's grid lines to be straight horizontal/vertical in the beginning, like the other ships. But in this case, they actually contour the hull along the same lines of the geometry, so it wasn't really a conscious choice. I'll take to it again to figure out a way to fix it, but it'll probably be a little while before I do.
It took me a while to find a balance between the two bridge styles, but I'm glad it seems to work.
Yeah, I love the STV shuttle redress in Generations. They even redressed the surviving full-sized mock-up (the other was cut down and modified for the type-6.) Too bad the scene of it landing was cut from the film. The type-6 was good for its time. It was the smaller shuttle, it was usually used to transport 1-4 people. It's good for that. For bigger jobs, they had the type-7. Too bad the full-sized type-7 looked so hideous, or they'd have never had to create the type-6.
(don't suppose you'd like to go back and finish it would you?
http://www.webolutionary.com/truespace/gallery/seanr/temp/bridge_ambassador2-12.jpg
http://www.webolutionary.com/truespace/gallery/seanr/temp/bridge_ambassador2-13.jpg
And red alert from a slightly earlier version:
http://www.webolutionary.com/truespace/gallery/seanr/temp/bridge_ambassador2r-1.jpg
It was probably one of those things where they wanted to have different models of shuttles and someone was poking around a warehouse, found that one and said, "Hey..."
I agree, it would have been cool to see it on the series. However, you also have to consider the series budget. While it was cheaper to modify the model than to build a new one, it still cost money. Also, that would have been another thing for them to keep and maintain and move in and out as the set was built and torn down/modified.
@Seanr Good point, bro! I'll reshape that platform as soon as I get back to finishing the bridge.
Business has picked up, so I haven't been able to focus as much on this recently. That said, this isn't much of an update, but I made some quick adjustments to the bridge lighting and shaped the viewscreen out. Still tons of work left to do (better textures and UV mapping, mostly), as well as the rest of the seating to add and the side rooms.
I did manage to get the shuttle completely textured though. Not sure if I'm going to build the interior for this one...
And to Pearse's point, I would've liked to have seen the full main shuttlebay on TNG as well, so I boxed one out at proper scale for this ship.
I realize it's not finished, but are you planning on refining that area where the rim around the upper bulkhead meets the viewer wall? It just looks a little off where it plows into the wall without meeting up with the ceiling light frames.
ever think of putting chairs in for the standing consoles? like they Finally did for Worf in generations?
@ Basill - Yeah, man. I figure if we're going to have a viewscreen, let's not have one where people need to squint!
And yeah, I do plan on doing something else with that part of the structure. I can't really find good established references for that area, so I'll probably do some sketching to see what looks good. I've had to revert to backups of the larger model body, so I may have to turn the focus back to finishing the space-frame of the ship for a little bit... -_-
As for the bridge and the other interior sets, I'm leaning towards stepping back and getting the sketchbook out to get a better feel for how they all need to look. Hopefully, that will keep me from rebuilding them into oblivion :P
@Pearse - Those are both good suggestions
I thinking about removing the platforms, lowering helm/conn stations to the floor. Also, the tactical station behind the captain's chair will have two seats, as well as the flanking communications/science stations.