It took a bit, but I think IAâve got the basic shape of the secondary hull now. Really not an easy piece - I had hoped that the Whitefire blueprints are correct in proportions, but after comparing it to the reference, I found out that they are not. So I put pictures of the model in the background and moved points til it somehow fits. Still tons of work to do...
The Whitefire blueprints look good to me, but I haven't examined them as closely as you have. I'm just amazed that after two years we still don't have official blueprints of the JJprise. I don't get it.
I'm currently taking a stab at this myself using Ed's blueprints although what you have achieved in a week has taken me at least eight! I was getting so wound up over the neck section at one point that I had to put it down for a few days!! I managed to get the thing looking okay for the most part but I'm still not happy with it and will no doubt have to brave the challenge of remodelling the neck section once again!
I found the deflector dish housing a bit of a pig as well!!!
As to the accuracy of the Whitefire blueprints...
For the most part I have found them pretty good; detailwise they're reasonably faithful to the shooting model and when you take into account that they were probably drawn up freehand then they're arguably the best prints around! The most telling oversight comes when you're about to work those pylons up to the underside of the nacelles; very much a line of best fit approach!
I look forward to more updates on this; not only are you modelling my favourite piece of Trek, I also thoroughly enjoy following your threads!
Looks exquisite so far. I'm really glad you're doing an updated big D. I think the bulge on the underside of the saucer should be in a different smoothing group than the rest of the underside, but that engineering section looks bang on. The six foot filming model is far superior to the four foot one in terms of scale and detail, so I'm happy you chose this one. The Enterprise D is the most futuristic looking of all the Enterprises IMHO.
I for one, like the 6 footer better as well, just seems less blocky!!
when i was builing the chyenne... the darn neck.... literally 30 times to get it right!
Looking great as always!! are you building the saucer, neck, and eng section all together at once ( as in one big piece?) yeah.. smoothing in Maya is Not your best friend.......
The whole saucer and secondary hull is one big fat subd polygon mesh at the moment. I too noticed that the edge on the lower saucer buldge should be slightly sharper - but that should be an easy fix.
I found the neck and the deflector areas especially difficult, as it is not that easy to see how the lines are flowing in these areas. I believe there are a lot of differences in the different models we have seen over the years (the 4 footer, the 6 footer, the Generations model (which I think is basically the 6 footer) and especially the digital version of the last "Enterprise" episode).
I found the neck and the deflector areas especially difficult, as it is not that easy to see how the lines are flowing in these areas. I believe there are a lot of differences in the different models we have seen over the years (the 4 footer, the 6 footer, the Generations model (which I think is basically the 6 footer) and especially the digital version of the last "Enterprise" episode).
So what you're saying is that trying to get it to be pixel perfect and definitive is kinda pointless!. Anyway, I think the saucer that crashed in Generations was a different and larger scale model too, so that will certainly have some differences too as well as a level of detail not seen on the TV models.
the 6-footer, if my memory does not betray me, was the one built for saucer separation. the 4-footer was built because the 6' one was too bulky, so they made another that was smaller and better detailed. So the "ultimate" Ent D should combine the details of the 4' with the lines and shape of the 6'. But any way you dice it, its my favorite ship. :thumb:
So what you're saying is that trying to get it to be pixel perfect and definitive is kinda pointless!. Anyway, I think the saucer that crashed in Generations was a different and larger scale model too, so that will certainly have some differences too as well as a level of detail not seen on the TV models.
Yea, I believe that saucer was 12 foot across... if I remember the bonus features right... haven't watched them in a while, lol.
AMD Ryzen 9 5900X Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB 1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD 32 GB RAM Windows 11 Pro
the 6-footer, if my memory does not betray me, was the one built for saucer separation. the 4-footer was built because the 6' one was too bulky, so they made another that was smaller and better detailed. So the "ultimate" Ent D should combine the details of the 4' with the lines and shape of the 6'. But any way you dice it, its my favorite ship. :thumb:
The 4 footer may have been more detailed, but I wouldn't ever call it better detailed. The 6 footer was a much more attractive version of the design.
The real reason why the 4' model was created was because 10 Forward was only 1/2 deck high on the 6' model, so they needed to thicken the saucer for the second season. Also, there was worry that the detail on the 6' model was too subtle to show up on a television screen, so they made the detail more pronounced on the 4' model. This had the unfortunate side effect of ruining the scale of the model and making the ship appear to be much smaller than it should. The hull plating would have to have ~3' bumps in order for the detail on the 4' model to make sense, and that has no explanation in the ship's design or construction. The beauty of the larger model was that from far away it looked sleek and smooth, but the closer one got to it the more details would pop. This is why the 6' model and even the footage from the TNG pilot looked so nice in Generations, and this is what I'm hoping to see in Tobias's model.
@Pixel: I'd have to rewatch Generations again, but I think in that shot they reused the footage of the Enterprise from the scene in Farpoint when they turn around to run away from Q, just before the saucer separation. I could be wrong though.
I thought they didn't start using CG models in the movies until First Contact?
I never heard them mention a CG model in the bonus features, and I have the Special Collectors Edition, lol.
I think the model of the Enterprise B they used for the shots in the Nexus was CG, although I have a high potential to be wrong again.:)
I imagine it's going to be a challenge just to choose the proper source material for this project. It gets confusing because there are at least two different on screen models and all are canon.:argh:
@Pixel: I'd have to rewatch Generations again, but I think in that shot they reused the footage of the Enterprise from the scene in Farpoint when they turn around to run away from Q, just before the saucer separation. I could be wrong though.
I think the model of the Enterprise B they used for the shots in the Nexus was CG, although I have a high potential to be wrong again.:)
I imagine it's going to be a challenge just to choose the proper source material for this project. It gets confusing because there are at least two different on screen models and all are canon.:argh:
Yea, they re-used a few shots from TNG in Generations... which makes me wonder, why bringing TNG to blu-ray would be hard to do... minus redoing the VFX, if they used some TNG shots in Generations, which also has been released in blu-ray...
Yea, I knew the Ent-B was CG in most if not all of the Nexus shots, but didn't know the Enterprise D was CG in some shots as well, lol.
As far I knew, they didn't beginning really using a lot of CG ships until First Contact.
AMD Ryzen 9 5900X Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB 1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD 32 GB RAM Windows 11 Pro
I think they did a few CGI shots of the Enterprise to see if they could do it, and if anyone would or could spot it,
Did they even make a Ent E Model for FC?
I always thought the main difference between the largest D model and the next scale down , apart from the saucer separation, was that Ten Forward was not really visible on the larger model
yeah it was used in similar situations as the one in generations was, for warp stretching and shots where it's distant, stuff like that
they were done at a time where cg was still quite young, and back then the artists seemed to know more about what they were working with and took more care to make sure things looked as good as they possibly could, also they weren't overly ambitious with their shots - they took it to the limits but didn't go beyond - which is why stuff like jurassic park look so good and stuff like clash of the titans looks shizer
A few of the Ent E shots in FC are of the model...
A few other shots... I guess they went to CG for most of the movie, because according to the Bonus Features, they couldn't get the studio model to look right all the time, they'd get it looking right one way, and then it would look off another way.
Well, this shot must be CG, however it's far from distant, lol.
Looking at this closely you can see where the vertex points are...
Especially right there in front of the bridge...
______________________________________________________________________________________
Anyway, can't wait for more updates on this Ent-D.
AMD Ryzen 9 5900X Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB 1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD 32 GB RAM Windows 11 Pro
Posts
They had a show on way back, covering the auction, they showed quite a few people, not sure if they showed the person who got the Enterprise D...
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
How 'bout one of those 1-person jobbies like Kirk rode in Engineering on the Enterprise refit in Wrath of Khan?
The Whitefire blueprints look closer to being designed after this miniature:
At least, when comparing the deflector dish area...
Personally, I think the other miniature used in TNG and Generations looks better in design...
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
I'm currently taking a stab at this myself using Ed's blueprints although what you have achieved in a week has taken me at least eight! I was getting so wound up over the neck section at one point that I had to put it down for a few days!! I managed to get the thing looking okay for the most part but I'm still not happy with it and will no doubt have to brave the challenge of remodelling the neck section once again!
I found the deflector dish housing a bit of a pig as well!!!
As to the accuracy of the Whitefire blueprints...
For the most part I have found them pretty good; detailwise they're reasonably faithful to the shooting model and when you take into account that they were probably drawn up freehand then they're arguably the best prints around! The most telling oversight comes when you're about to work those pylons up to the underside of the nacelles; very much a line of best fit approach!
I look forward to more updates on this; not only are you modelling my favourite piece of Trek, I also thoroughly enjoy following your threads!
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqRhLEHgwgTKxsalM5YznYQ
Formerly furswift
when i was builing the chyenne... the darn neck.... literally 30 times to get it right!
Looking great as always!! are you building the saucer, neck, and eng section all together at once ( as in one big piece?) yeah.. smoothing in Maya is Not your best friend.......
I found the neck and the deflector areas especially difficult, as it is not that easy to see how the lines are flowing in these areas. I believe there are a lot of differences in the different models we have seen over the years (the 4 footer, the 6 footer, the Generations model (which I think is basically the 6 footer) and especially the digital version of the last "Enterprise" episode).
So what you're saying is that trying to get it to be pixel perfect and definitive is kinda pointless!.
Yea, I believe that saucer was 12 foot across... if I remember the bonus features right... haven't watched them in a while, lol.
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
The 4 footer may have been more detailed, but I wouldn't ever call it better detailed. The 6 footer was a much more attractive version of the design.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqRhLEHgwgTKxsalM5YznYQ
Formerly furswift
Tobias i tip my hat off to you my friend, this is turning out to be a great model! Can't wait to see more!
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
I thought they didn't start using CG models in the movies until First Contact?
I never heard them mention a CG model in the bonus features, and I have the Special Collectors Edition, lol.
Well, here is pictures that I know is the model, lol.
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
yes they used a CG model a couple of times generations, I have it here actually, it's game res by today's standards but it still holds up well
I think the model of the Enterprise B they used for the shots in the Nexus was CG, although I have a high potential to be wrong again.:)
I imagine it's going to be a challenge just to choose the proper source material for this project. It gets confusing because there are at least two different on screen models and all are canon.:argh:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqRhLEHgwgTKxsalM5YznYQ
Formerly furswift
the nexus effects were just quality, hard to believe they were done so long ago
Game res? Seriously? It looks higher poly than that, lol.
I was 4 years old when Generations came out.
Yea, they re-used a few shots from TNG in Generations... which makes me wonder, why bringing TNG to blu-ray would be hard to do... minus redoing the VFX, if they used some TNG shots in Generations, which also has been released in blu-ray...
Yea, I knew the Ent-B was CG in most if not all of the Nexus shots, but didn't know the Enterprise D was CG in some shots as well, lol.
As far I knew, they didn't beginning really using a lot of CG ships until First Contact.
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
Did they even make a Ent E Model for FC?
I always thought the main difference between the largest D model and the next scale down , apart from the saucer separation, was that Ten Forward was not really visible on the larger model
they were done at a time where cg was still quite young, and back then the artists seemed to know more about what they were working with and took more care to make sure things looked as good as they possibly could, also they weren't overly ambitious with their shots - they took it to the limits but didn't go beyond - which is why stuff like jurassic park look so good and stuff like clash of the titans looks shizer
A few of the Ent E shots in FC are of the model...
A few other shots... I guess they went to CG for most of the movie, because according to the Bonus Features, they couldn't get the studio model to look right all the time, they'd get it looking right one way, and then it would look off another way.
Well, this shot must be CG, however it's far from distant, lol.
Looking at this closely you can see where the vertex points are...
Especially right there in front of the bridge...
______________________________________________________________________________________
Anyway, can't wait for more updates on this Ent-D.
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro
this is going off topic now, I'll just correct you on your last post and then we should let this get back to normal
first contact was 99% physical model, the cg model was used in like 4 or 5 shots
ok, yea, don't want to side track the thread.
Gigabyte RTX 3080 Gaming OC 12GB
1TB NVMe SSD, 2 x 1GB SATA SSD, 4TB external HDD
32 GB RAM
Windows 11 Pro