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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3393 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,493Member
    If it was max I would suspect low particle or FG points and a too high interpolation. In max you have points per X unit in a field. More there are the more it can be accurate to what is in scene etc. Usually it means if your settings are not tuned right youll get right angle faces with this "spill" or leaking going on. I had this issue back in 2012 or so with my hull panels and lum lights in rooms behind the hull so I would get sparklers between the hull panels as the angles in there allowed it to leak out.

    The distance thing depends how your interpolating and what settings are available to the particle (nodes etc whatever the renderer uses to calculate the photons) system. In max I use radius interpo to avoid a lot of the fireflys and other artifacts that can happen when doing crazy things with lum (self lighting mats)

    ALSO if your mesh isnt watertight lum can cause a lot of light leaks. Sometimes it wont other times it will. So if your room interiors for example are just open sided boxes situated behind the hull likely youll get a load of light bleed. If the rooms are balloons extruded from the window frames usually a good particle count and interpolation should avoid leaks or "spots"

    Anyhow hope it helps some for a solution. I have not looked too much at LW real light rendering. From what I have read it is a lot like max's Mental Ray.

    Also swap LUM for whatever system the software has that has light emission materials or surfaces (ignoring self ilum as most of those are just a color value that does not produce real particles creating ambient light.)
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    edited July 2019 #93
    I tried closing up the front of the engine housing the other day, but it was no use. I also tried adding more bits to block the light, but that wasn't working either. So, I rebuilt the impulse guts.

    I suspect it was something in the GI settings, but I didn't find what it was and I tried all kinds of things.

    I did a test on the windows earlier and didn't see any issues. The only thing they were lacking was proper mapping. ;)
    Post edited by evil_genius_180 on
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3393 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,493Member
    It might be GI as that would have a density pattern and interpolation related to it but I would suspect whatever LW uses to produce the point calculations for the emissions materials might be at fault and to see if any of it is camera driven or calculated based on distance from the "viewer". Solution to the near/far is to set whatever LW uses to be physical IE distances vs from camera distance.

    Kinda sucks you had to loose the details there as it looked really cool.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    I technically still have the old part, it's part of two other files. ;)
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    I decided I wasn’t in the mood to work on the Enterprise last night, so I planned to start a new ship instead. However, the new ship was going to be a design I’ve done before, so I took a look at my old model and decided it’s not too bad. It was for a fan film project I was involved in back in 2014. For full details, see this post:

    Anyway, getting the model back into Lightwave 10 and taking a look at it, I decided there wouldn’t be much to be gained by starting a new model. So, I started modifying the existing one. I started by getting rid of a lot of the greeblies and stuff. These bits were things I added after I finished the model initially, but I was trying to add more visual interest. Most of that stuff came from the Constellation class and really didn’t fit, so I got rid of it. I also got rid of the trenches. I have something else in mind for back there. Getting rid of those involved destroying geometry and creating new faces. That didn’t take too terribly long. Then the real fun began. I had to remove the name and registry from the ship. Well, I didn’t have to, but I wanted to. I’m not a huge fan of doing earlier versions of canon ships. Besides, that name and registry were for that fan film and I really don’t want them on the model. So, that was a long and tedious process, but it’s done. Then I imported the impulse engines from my Enterprise WIP because I like how I did them. AFter that, I started fooling around with materials. There’s still a long way to go, including adding some parts and possibly doing new textures, but it’s a start:






    After that, I started messing around with some of the other models I did for that project. One of which is a Klingon D7:




    I like that model and plan to use it. It may also get new textures. It’s a shame I don’t have my Romulan ship anymore, but I can always build another one. That’s actually the easier of the two TOS main alien ships to build.

    Then there’s this:


    It’s pretty much an upscaled and TOS-ified Regula type station, dubbed Starbase 15. I see no reason to change that name, as it’s not like “Starbase X” is specific to any show or another. I think they just drew numbers out of a hat for those. 😉 To give an idea of how big it is, here it is next to a ship:


    It’s pretty large. I didn’t feel that Regula was big enough to fill the role of a Starbase space station, so I super sized it. I do need to redo some of the greebles. Again, some of that stuff was from the Constellation class. I dind’t have a lot of time working on that project, as I was the only model maker and then they also wanted me to do animation, which I had to teach myself how to do. But, that’s in the past. So, I might as well use those models for something. 🙂
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    I added some boxy sensor things to the places where the trenches used to be. I figure this looks more TOS than greeble filled trenches do. Also, I’ve decided the ship doesn’t need new textures. Much like the modeling, there would only be minor improvements that are outweighed by the amount of work involved. So, I’m going to leave them alone. I may redo the interior, though, as what’s there is pretty awful. 😛

    Also, I’m still deciding on a name for the ship. (no, I’m not looking for suggestions)


  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    Awsome stuff. Love the station - Very Starfleet.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks. :)

    This will pretty much do it for the updates to this ship. (aside from the issue with the interior) The idea here wasn’t to take all year on this, as it’s supposed to just be an update. Most of the stuff I wanted to change on it got changed with minimal work. I look at this kind of ship as a utility ship. It’s something that does various missions in Starfleet space. This is pretty much backed up by what we’ve seen on screen with the Miranda class. The Reliant and other Miranda class ships have been seen on scientific missions. Others have been used as cargo ships. Some are outfitted for patrol duty, such as the Soyuz-class USS Bozeman. And, who knows what kind of assignment the Saratoga was on before the battle of Wolf 359. And, of course, many were used as cannon fodder destroyers in engagements in the Dominion War. This all fits with a general purpose type of ship. It’s way smaller than your big explorers, but still pretty heavily armed. This one is even smaller than the Miranda class. So, as it’s a utility ship, being an ex Army man, I thought of the utility helicopter, the Sikorsky UH-60 Black Hawk. I’ve ridden in a few of those. 😉 I did a search and found no canon or even licensed ship named the Black Hawk. However, I found a US Naval tradition going back to the Civil War. A ship with the name USS Black Hawk was used in a number of battles. The ship was commissioned in 1848, but it wasn’t a Navy ship then, it was a civilian liner. 1848 is within the sphere of TOS registries, as NCC-1831 appears on a chart in “Court Martial,” (one on the chart might be NCC-1864 as well) so I used that as the registry. The name carried over to the 20th century a well, as I fount two different Black Hawks. The only thing Trek related I found was some fan group with what looks like a website out of the 1990s that doesn’t look like it’s been updated in a few years. But, I never worry about fan stuff and that’s a Sovereign-class ship anyway.

    So, here it is:







    I tried lighting the registry on the saucer, but I was only going to do it if it would work with modeled light sources. I couldn’t get them to shine on the hull just right because I wasn’t cheating it. And, I didn’t want to do several little lights as they do on a lot of modern Trek. So, I decided to just drop the whole idea.
  • FreakFreak1057 Posts: 4,325Member
    I remember that ship.
    Has been five years already since you worked on that fan film.

    Time does fly.

    I look forward to seeing what you do next with her.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks Dean. Yeah, it doesn't seem like 5 years.
  • ashleytingerashleytinger711 Central OhioPosts: 687Member
    Wow. The Black Hawk looks great!
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks a lot. :)
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    edited July 2019 #104
    I love the paneling work you can see on the front of the bottom render of your Black Hawk. It is also a nice design. Somehow the model needs something. One thing that immediately comes to mind is detail around the bases of the pylons between the engines and saucer. Some kind of attachment fairing or at least a gap that gives the impression of an construction connection. You did this super well with the gap around the forward torpedo tubes. Maybe even those spaced tiny polygons that you see at the base of the pylon attachment to the engine in this Tobias Richter model. However I will admit that it is a "refit" feature and possibly not representative of a TOS or pre TOS ship. But notice, you did get a paneling look on your saucer like he has at the back of the engine and that definitely is advanced work and in advance of what they did on TOS ships.
    Post edited by Brandenberg on
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    edited July 2019 #105
    You got the individual piece construction look very nicely here while still retaining a TOS look. The flair at the base of the cover with the surrounding black gap. Also the dark line around the top indentations. Bravo.


    Another place that might benefit from the same idea. Some kind of scoring on the front facing part of the body here. BTW I know what a difficult part this is to do that on. I wrestled with this same area on my Wrath of Kahn Miranda.


    Post edited by Brandenberg on
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks for the compliments and suggestions, Brandenberg. :)

    I'll look at those things, but I've kind of moved on to starting another project. ;) Stuff like the part with the windows where it transitions from the saucer to the taller back part is one of the reasons I was thinking of rebuilding this ship. I still may, it's hard to say.

    The ship (originally) was supposed to be late TOS. The fan film was set in the early 2270s, when the Enterprise was getting its refit. In fact, the writer had a thing about showing that, even though I tried explaining how much of a pain that was going to be.
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    Oh. There is more backstory than I knew. Anyway you are welcome.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Yeah, they had an established time period for when the thing took place. It was in that time period where you still had TOS uniforms and could use TOS sets, but more details could be added to the ships too. Though, I add them anyway. ;)
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Another thing I've thought of is, instead of further modifying this model or building a new one exactly like it, maybe I'll do a refit version.
  • scifiericscifieric853 Posts: 1,252Member
    No matter what you choose to do, I will be fascinated to watch it develop. You are doing GREAT work, Chris. It is a pleasure to see!
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks Eric. :)
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    scifieric wrote: »
    No matter what you choose to do, I will be fascinated to watch it develop. You are doing GREAT work, Chris. It is a pleasure to see!

  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    edited July 2019 #113
    I think I would love to know what textures you used to do the effect you got on the bottom. It's exceptional.
    Post edited by Brandenberg on
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks a lot, bro. It's just some paneling that I drew back in 2010-ish. It's a grayscale 4K specular map with the paneling on it. Then I have a color map, also with the paneling very lightly on it. Using Lightwave 10 materials, I applied it with a 90% diffuse, 20% Specular and 20% Glossiness.

    Here's a screenshot of what the specular paneling looks like:


    I don't remember what art program I used for the paneling. Probably Inkscape, I use that one a lot.
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    Thanks so much. That's helpful.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    This is an idea I’ve been playing around with for a while. I don’t know if it’s going any further than this. The idea is that this is a very small ship. It’s not something that would go into deep space or on missions of long duration. Even with pattern replication, a ship this small simply couldn’t sustain itself long term. It could be a support ship for a Starbase, or something like that.




    But, I’m not really sure I like it all that well, so it may just go away. But this is what I’ve been working on lately.
  • ViperViper1085 Posts: 654Administrator
    Interesting. With more work on the hull and the nacelles it could turn into a cool little ship.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    Thanks. I'm going to delete everything but the saucer here in a bit and see what else I can come up with. I may go blockier for the secondary hull to allow more internal volume.
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1486 CaliforniaPosts: 1,855Member
    A type of Runabout?
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    It's bigger than a runabout. I'm thinking maybe some sort of transport.

    As this design seems to be generating interest, I may do something with it. I still have to work out something that looks better for the secondary hull, though. I may work with what I have and make some changes to the underside, which is really ugly, and do something else for the shuttlebay.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_1801842 Posts: 9,995Member
    So, this is where I’m at with this little funky design.



    The underside is pretty flat right now, so I’m not showing it just yet. After several attempts to redo the secondary hull to something I like, I wound up just going with what I had before, but with some modifications. Right now, this ship is around 81.5m long, 45.6m wide and 11.35m tall. It’s going to get taller when I add a bridge and something to the bottom. As previously stated, this is a support ship, so it’s nothing that is going to have to survive for long periods of time on its own. I’m also thinking it doesn’t have a very big crew, maybe 15 or so. It would likely mostly be used for transport duties, possibly the occasional scouting or scientific mission. It also would likely be used for defense.

    The square part in the back is going to be for a shuttlebay, I’m thinking it only carries one shuttle. I’m not planning on giving it the ability to land, as landing gear would take up too much of the finite internal space. That’s what transporters are for. Anyway, that’s what I have for now.
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