3DCompletely new rear hull.

Judge Death.

Here's a completely new version of the hephaestus' rear hull, built from scratch. I hope people like it more than the old one.


It's a very early stage, no detail yet. I hope people like it better. Haven't fisnshed the front, deflector/scanner section or the rear shuttlebay section. Not sure how to finish either yet.


The new design still meets my ideas of looking like the basic design of federation ships but with significant differences, reflecting fed tech used by someone with a different set of values and ideas on ship design. I like the combo of flowing curves and sharp lines. I want to keep the idea that the rear section is not meant for atmospheric operations while the saucer is.

I'm still having a few problems with the design in some places, but have really made a quantum leap in how I model, this is far more freeform and flowing than any of my earlier designs.

Edit, dited to remove very early views and add a new thread picture.

Judge Death.

I'm adding the parts from earlier version in addition to making new parts. I think it's the best looking thing I've made in blender so far.

I also had my "blender moment" when I looked at the ship from certain angles. The blender moment is when you realize you've finally created something that you at least consider beautiful, great looking impressive, etc. The pics here just made me feel that I'd finally reached a point in blender that I was getting somewhere.

NRH7_zps3db67a7c.png

NRH8_zps97692fed.png


I'd adding detail, like the torpedo tubes and the sensor ring around the dish rim.

Judge Death.

BTW, I was hoping the new rear hull would answer some of the criticisms I got that the old versions were too blocky for a trek ship.

vivienneanthony

The hull flows a lot better now. The nacelles can be streamlined a little. It's overall better then blender. Are you creating the materials in Cycles?

Judge Death.

vivienneanthony wrote: »

The hull flows a lot better now. The nacelles can be streamlined a little. It's overall better then blender. Are you creating the materials in Cycles?

Uh, what materials? Seriously, I'm still stuck on modelling, those materials are mostly just tweaks of the basic martial, altered with the color wheel and in some cases with transparency and/or luminosity added.

I'd like to get to materials someday, hopefully chris kuhn will do a book opn that as his current blender aid ebook has been a godsend to me.

BTW, newest pic, I added those bits to the forward hull ahead of the nacelle mounts but I'm not sure what they are for/meant to do. I just had a damn urge to add them I couldn't resist. Like I say, I usually know what things do and usually disdain adding stuff that 'just looks cool" but something about these just demanded I add them...

NEWREARHULL8_zpsf18f059c.png

I'm probably going to rip out the current torpedo tubes above the sensor/deflector array and redo them more like the new bits now that I know how to do it.

Tovette

Looking good so far!

Judge Death.

Slow painful progress continues. I struggled with the engine pylons for a long time before realizing the geometry made my idea impossible, so I had to delete the pylon mounts and pylons, extrude now mounts, then I extruded the new pylons from the mounts. rotated and dragged them to made with the engines and used bevelling and looping to finish them.

In other areas I redid the torpedo tubes and added the side multispectral sensor array to the lower forward hull.

nrh11_zpsca4b5b59.png

nrh13_zps5d7b752f.png


I'm still dithering on what to do with the front and back, the main array and the shuttle bay. I may make the shuttle doors hinged like a pickup truck rear door and just lower like that. I might make the curved upper section of the rear an aft sensor array to discourage those pesky rear attacks.
nrgh12_zpsbe9504f1.png

Judge Death.

Finally started tackling the biggies, the front array. The ring of panels shown will have blue or violet (If can find a shade that doesn't look to....you know.) to reflect the fact it's a sensor array optimized for high frequency work.

The next inner one will be a mid range frequency set that will be green and the last will be red for lw freq. The center will be the deflector.

nrh12_zps72abc27a.png

Maybe the ship, with the torpedo tubes above the array, looks vaguely like a face with a huge exaggerated mouth and small eyes, but so be it. It worked for the ship in heavy metal's 'so beautiful, so dangerous."

publiusr

An octagonal saucer might look better on that sec hull.

Judge Death.

The saucer must be atmo able, it's mean to when necessary detach and land on a stricked planet to reder aid faster and more effectively. Being on a ground might make it a sitting target hence the armored upper section. The underside is meant for landing, the huge impulse engines are for flight.

Judge Death.

Finally closed the front end with a finished array. The colord bands are specialized spectral sensor arrays, the middle part is the deflector.

array_zps80239b27.png

Judge Death.

Finally got the rear hull sealed up by finishing the shuttle bay at the stern.

TAIL_zps8a2a93ae.png

Rather than the complex, elaborate clamshell or roll top desk style arrangements seen on many starships, the Hephaestus' engineering hull shuttlebay uses a simple trapdoor type arrangement similar in operation to the tailgate on a pickup truck, resulting in a simpler, more rugged door and operating mechanism.

The blue window above is is an aft sesnor array to prevent those embarrassing and annoying surprise attacks to the stern. The aft torpedo tubes are visible over the shuttle bay.

Judge Death.

On a roll tonight, added the rear hull's impulse engines. Yes she has 3, the hephaestus was designed with heavy towing operations in mind.IMPULSE_zps2c00f45d.png

Also, large impulse engines double as fusion reactors, and can provide huge amounts of energy from low level elements when not being used for propulsion. The ability to use hydrogen, helium and other common elements for energy is useful.

Judge Death.

hephrender_zpsfe6a4697.png

I've done this in cycles render preview mode and did some basic node materials. I find the basic un noded material still works great as a basic hull material. I added some machinery to the bussard collectors and thanks to peter draculic I added the phaser tracks to the hull. Thank you, Mr. Draculic!

Judge Death.

prevurend_zps3f49139f.png

Doing some lighting, the lights are a large yellowish star, a smaller purplish planet and a white light for beneral illumination. Time to look into ambient occlusion, I guess.

songokusatsu

simpy wonderful 10/10 hope you upload her.....once she is done

Judge Death.

I''ve recently had a massive explosion in my bklender skillz which let me redo her like this and get this far, but I'm reaching the limits of my new skill level. Unless I develop some more I may be stuck. Glad you like her. I'm looking into some fine tuning of modeling skills and them lighting, texturing, rendering, etc.

Judge Death.

I am trying to redo the upper saucer to make the armor panels in accordance with some help I've been given, and doing so mandated a new impulse/docking tail.

This one is smaller than the old one and not as elaborate, but the mesh is much neater thanks to some knife work and careful looping. How does it look? Too small? I plan on detailing it later.

I was also thinking of some flying buttress type braces extending from the sides of the tail to the back edge of the saucer. Good idea?

Judge Death.

Here's a quick model of what I was talking about, the flying buttressing around the impulse tail:

butress3_zpsb77b2a83.png

butress1_zpse0f0f16a.png

butress2_zpsf78d1012.png

I sort of like them, from an engineering pov I was hoping they would not seem to interfere with the impulse engines, as in the internal bracing get in the way. Maybe I could slide the edge of the engine outlets over a little towards the center, leave a thicker side for the bracing to be built into...

McC

It looks a little small without the buttresses, but with them in there it looks awesome! :thumb:

Judge Death.

Thanks. Here's the current status on the buttresses. I moved them up a little and added a recess for detail. Better with or without the recess, or maybe a hollow space in the middle?

image293_zps5c0c0b58.png

McC

Hmm...I think I would make the recess an extrusion, actually. I like it as a visual element to give the flat surface of the buttress more character, but it would feel Trekier if it came up out of the hull.

Also, I think you might get a lot of mileage out of some "sub-buttresses." Rather than having a full gap between each of the buttresses, keep them divided as they are now, but repeat the shape inside that gap, slightly recessed to retain the multi-layered visual element you've got going on now. If that doesn't make sense, I can do up an example.

Judge Death.

Uh, let's see, male each buttress a single structure but have some recessed areas in it along the sides? I'm not sure I'm seeing what you're saying exactly.

McC

Like so:

Judge Death.

McC wrote: »

Like so:

Oh, OK. Yes, that looks good and easy, a rare and much loved combination. I may add a bevel to the edges to produce a concave curve.

Judge Death.

latest flying buttress rework. Not quite as beveled as I wanted, but is may look ok anyway.

image23_zps402a25b3.png

McC

That's coming along! I might pull the "inner" buttresses out further, so they're a bit less hidden by the "outer" buttresses, but that's really just a taste thing.

The other thing that I'm seeing now is that the curvature on the impulse unit itself, given both the secondary hull and saucer placement as well as the shape of the buttresses, seems to be "backwards." Right now, it's convex, but it seems like it should be concave. Again, this is sort of a taste thing, and it actually does have some neat symmetry with the curvature under the saucer right now, but thought I'd mention it all the same.

Judge Death.

Ok, I'm kind of trying to keep the weight issue on the saucer's impulse/dock tail down, that's why I made it smaller this time. When the saucer is on a planet on it's landing pads the weight will be a little uneven towards the rear due to the tail and buttresses. I want to kind of minimize the weight imbalance by keeping the buttresses looking light. So i recessed the insets as much as I did.

Now the weight balance may be partly offset by the mass of the command section, which is more weighted towards the front but still i need to minimize the impulse/docking tail and buttresses to make it look like the saucer isn't too imbalanced to land.

I'm not sure what the second part of your feedback meant about the impulse unit looking backwards. I was going to flatten the end out but had a thought that the curve of the impulse outlets might help keep the impulse engine 'exhaust" (Output? Emissions?) off the rear hull as much as possible. In one episode it was stated that the output of the impulse engines weakened the shields over them, making it possible for a shuttle to penetrate the shields at that point. If the emissions of impulse engines are that potent it might be a good thing to minimize the amount that hits the hull.

If you can show me what you mean I'll look at it though, your advice has been rock solid and appreciated so far.

EDIT, I think I get it now, you mean like the excellsior's impulse engines, right? Yeah, that might actually work out, and make them seem less vulnerable to attack from some angles... have to think on that, Would need to flatten the impulse outlets, then pull out one set of verts after another to get that recurve effect.

I would like to keep the middle part as is to reflect it's mostly about docking the two sections together, so is wider ad the base than the top. It might make the impulse section look strange to have the impulse engines curving in the opposite direction, not quite sure how to do it but will at least think on it now that you're pointed it out.

McC

Judge Death. wrote: »

Ok, I'm kind of trying to keep the weight issue on the saucer's impulse/dock tail down, that's why I made it smaller this time. When the saucer is on a planet on it's landing pads the weight will be a little uneven towards the rear due to the tail and buttresses. I want to kind of minimize the weight imbalance by keeping the buttresses looking light. So i recessed the insets as much as I did.

Now the weight balance may be partly offset by the mass of the command section, which is more weighted towards the front but still i need to minimize the impulse/docking tail and buttresses to make it look like the saucer isn't too imbalanced to land.

I'm not sure that you need a perfectly balanced saucer to do your landing ops. Look at any modern jet fighter, for example. Its weight is heavily biased toward the back of the craft, with a narrow nose containing just the pilot, avionics, and sensor equipment. Everything else--the engines, the weaponry, the fuel tanks--is biased toward the middle or rear of the plane.

As such, you can simply add additional landing feet to support the extra rear weight. It's also worth considering the various handwaves made by the only Federation ship we've ever seen land. Voyager only had four landing feet, all of which resided inside the secondary hull. That means the tremendous weight of the entire "saucer" section had no ground support.

Memory Alpha wrote:

One of the few Starfleet starship classes capable of atmospheric entry and planetary landing, the Intrepid-class starship was equipped with antigravity generators as well as impulse and lifters strategically placed at the mass and stress points on the bottom portion of the secondary hull.

Unless there's some tremendous mass concentration toward the rear of an Intrepid (perhaps the warp coils are incredibly heavy?), there's no real way to justify its landing gear layout without incorporating some sort of technological handwave. Your saucer is a lot more balanced, and so can justify it far more easily by just increasing the landing foot count.

Alternately, you could have the primary impulse engines remain with the secondary hull and have the saucer undock from them, using only thrusters and antigrav to land.

I'm not sure what the second part of your feedback meant about the impulse unit looking backwards. I was going to flatten the end out but had a thought that the curve of the impulse outlets might help keep the impulse engine 'exhaust" (Output? Emissions?) off the rear hull as much as possible. In one episode it was stated that the output of the impulse engines weakened the shields over them, making it possible for a shuttle to penetrate the shields at that point. If the emissions of impulse engines are that potent it might be a good thing to minimize the amount that hits the hull.

If you can show me what you mean I'll look at it though, your advice has been rock solid and appreciated so far.

EDIT, I think I get it now, you mean like the excellsior's impulse engines, right? Yeah, that might actually work out, and make them seem less vulnerable to attack from some angles... have to think on that, Would need to flatten the impulse outlets, then pull out one set of verts after another to get that recurve effect.

I would like to keep the middle part as is to reflect it's mostly about docking the two sections together, so is wider ad the base than the top. It might make the impulse section look strange to have the impulse engines curving in the opposite direction, not quite sure how to do it but will at least think on it now that you're pointed it out.

Not quite like Excelsior's (although that's not a bad idea either!), but rather like Excelsior's flipped upside down. Like this:

Judge Death.

McC wrote: »

I'm not sure that you need a perfectly balanced saucer to do your landing ops. Look at any modern jet fighter, for example. Its weight is heavily biased toward the back of the craft, with a narrow nose containing just the pilot, avionics, and sensor equipment. Everything else--the engines, the weaponry, the fuel tanks--is biased toward the middle or rear of the plane.

As such, you can simply add additional landing feet to support the extra rear weight. It's also worth considering the various handwaves made by the only Federation ship we've ever seen land. Voyager only had four landing feet, all of which resided inside the secondary hull. That means the tremendous weight of the entire "saucer" section had no ground support.



Unless there's some tremendous mass concentration toward the rear of an Intrepid (perhaps the warp coils are incredibly heavy?), there's no real way to justify its landing gear layout without incorporating some sort of technological handwave. Your saucer is a lot more balanced, and so can justify it far more easily by just increasing the landing foot count.

Alternately, you could have the primary impulse engines remain with the secondary hull and have the saucer undock from them, using only thrusters and antigrav to land.


Not quite like Excelsior's (although that's not a bad idea either!), but rather like Excelsior's flipped upside down. Like this:

Oh great, now I have to figure out how to do that, because it does look good. it wouldn't exactly replicate due to the way the engines widen out along the sides but it would look cool.

Now I have to back up to a pre subsurrf applied version and try to replicate that.

Hunter G

I like this, very original, especially the saucer.