Funny how the sound effects technical side seems to be stalled forever in the 80s
It would have been fun to actually use those, but the quality is just to horrible.
The nacelles are drooping and the mid-bar in the port bussard collector is off center. Best side view is Enterprise #23. Wonder why the majority of them have drooping nacelles though?
Because there is absolutely nothing sound about this design in any way. All you have to do is look at where the warp pylons meet the nacelles... what horrible placement! It totally ignores the center of balance or gravity on the nacelles, which are morbidly obese to begin with.
I would assume that this is part of the reason why every 1701 after the TOS Connie, including the TMP refit, had the pylons positioned closer to the middle of the nacelles... because it was structurally better that way.
But, as is the case with all your models, Tobias, you're doing a great job, with the material you have to work with.
Funny how the sound effects technical side seems to be stalled forever in the 80s
It would have been fun to actually use those, but the quality is just to horrible.
I figured as much, but just thought I'd point it out. And let's face it, Playmates has never been very high quality anyways.
What does center of gravity have to do with anything on a SPACE ship? If we're going to get into that, every Enterprise has been extraordinarily top heavy for no reason.
True enough, but for the most part, the mass of the saucer section is typically greater than that of the engineering hull, except the B and the NX-01(mainly cause it was almost ALL saucer). As for the nacelles' odd placement on the pylons, who are we to say that it wouldn't work? After all, Star Trek's FICTIONAL ships are built out of materials we don't have in the 21st century.
Going back to the warp effect, if you look at this poster.
I was imagining the effect looking a bit like that, and as the ship slows, the light beams go from facing forward to behind and start to fade.
I noticed a few things looking at the photos of the Playmates toy. The lower edge of the saucer looks much more rounded than I'd first thought. I wonder if it's that way in the movie? Not very impressed with the look of the toy, though. Hard to believe that, after all these years, Playmates manufacturing techniques don't seem to have improved all that much. The ships Art Asylum and DST have released are miles beyond in terms of detail and quality.
And as much as I like the new look of the Big-E, I wish they had put some hull markings on the underside of the saucer. Just doesn't look right without them.
The argument about the placement and structure of the warp pylons is kind of pointless since we're talking science fiction here and any excuse can be made up as to why or how things work. The fact is, though, that even though objects are weightless in space they still have mass. And if you're going to attach one object to another, you'd better be sure the more massive object is held in place well or your spaceship won't stay together for very long, especially if it's going to be moving at high speed. Remember, mass increases as speed increases, even in space. if the supports aren't strong enough, the more massive pieces will tear the ship apart. So, again, as much as I like the new design the pylons don't look like they can support the mass of the warp engines. Since we're not likely to get a detailed explanation about the ship's structure in the film, the audience has only visual clues to go by and if something doesn't look right they'll notice, even if only on an instinctive level. It would have been better to slide the upper edge of the pylons back a bit toward the center of the engines.
Playmates has improved in that the ship is in one piece in box and they finally did away with the stickers, plus they have lots and lots of lights on this thing. Yes, Art Asylum's ships are a mile above it, but this is far better than Playmates' previous ships.
What does center of gravity have to do with anything on a SPACE ship? If we're going to get into that, every Enterprise has been extraordinarily top heavy for no reason.
Because unlike those other Enterprises, this one is built on the ground for some reason - and has to have a way to get from the ground and into space.
Center of gravity has everything to do with a spacecraft. Thrust must be applied in line with the center of gravity or the vehicle will tumble. Take the Enterprise impulse engines. They are at a point that can be considered the center of gravity. Some trek ship designs don't really follow this, namely the Excelsior, Ambassador, and Galaxy classes.
For a more real-world example take the Space Shuttle. If you look at the angle of the Main engines, they follow a line through the center of gravity of the Shuttle/External Tank configuration. The OMS engines follow a center of gravity line of just the orbiter itself.
There are also other considerations. Larger masses close to the center of gravity/thrust move the center less than a mass further out. For the Enterprise, this means that the Warp engines are closer to the center of gravity than the engineering hull and they balance each other out. Since we only have the volumes to go by, and not the mass, it is hard to tell exactly where the center of gravity of the entire ship would really be.
Either way, the impulse drive, by design and function, MUST be able to break a planetary gravity field and achieve orbit. Otherwise, the ships would fall to their doom every time they went into orbit.
on the original they were RED (don't come with the "it's not, it's actually orange-yellowish-flickering-rotating-blinking", it's RED
They were NOT red. Have you ever actually WATCHED TOS?? They were red for "The Cage" and "Where No Man Has Gone Before," but I'm afraid that they WERE orange-flickering-rotating-blinking.
I wonder if the die hard TOS fans were saying simular things when TMP came out.
"A blue deflector, what happened to the dish?"
In TMP, the deflector actually is "copper" when powered down and never really glowed blue until they hit warp (and got stuck in that wormhole). From then on it was pretty much blue.
Since when does real physics matter in Trek. If so we'd have people aging even slower the closer they got to the speed of light. There wouldn't be sound effects for things going on in space, etc etc. So the real answer to the whole center of gravity issue that some people complain about doesn't matter.
Since when does real physics matter in Trek. If so <snip> There wouldn't be sound effects for things going on in space, etc etc.
Actually, according to several sources they actually attempted several of the battle sequences in Wrath without sound ... but the test audiences thought there was something wrong. So, they added the sound back in.
They were NOT red. Have you ever actually WATCHED TOS?? They were red for "The Cage" and "Where No Man Has Gone Before," but I'm afraid that they WERE orange-flickering-rotating-blinking.
In TMP, the deflector actually is "copper" when powered down and never really glowed blue until they hit warp (and got stuck in that wormhole). From then on it was pretty much blue.
The Deflector on the TMP Enterprise is white when off and then copper during startup and finally blue
I thought the warp coils produce a bubble of "Space-time"? Gravity within that bubble would not be a factor... or would it? I know form reading books and watching the shows a ship is unable to go into warp in a planets gravity well, but bringing the warp coils online then using the inpulse engines on the surface of the planet would make the ship weightless.... Would it not?
I thought the warp coils produce a bubble of "Space-time"? Gravity within that bubble would not be a factor... or would it? I know form reading books and watching the shows a ship is unable to go into warp in a planets gravity well, but bringing the warp coils online then using the inpulse engines on the surface of the planet would make the ship weightless.... Would it not?
They would not be able to create a "warp field" in a gravity well. why not is technobabble gibberish.
The Deflector on the TMP Enterprise is white when off and then copper during startup and finally blue
Actually, if you look at it carefully, there is no white or copper. The off color is translucent grey. The startup color is yellow. And actually, only the photage shot for TMP ever shows any yellow. The TMP Enterprise has no paint on the translucent resin. The color comes from how it is illuminated.
They would not be able to create a "warp field" in a gravity well. why not is technobabble gibberish.
The statement you refer to is from TMP and comes from Isaac Asimov who served as science advisor. The only way it makes sense is if it is a Starfleet regulation like the no fly zone over the White House.
A good example of why it isn't a rule in the Trek universe is 'The Naked Time' where the Enterprise warps away from the planet and hurtles back in time (the time travel was due to the cold start, not the planet's gravity according to the episode). In The Voyage Home the Bird of Prey warps around the sun. In Star Trek III the Enterprise warps away from the Excelsior just outside of Space Dock (no time distortion on this one at all). I'm sure there are other examples, but these should do for a start.
The no warp inside of a solar system rule is probably due more to something akin to traffic control issues. Especually since you'd have so many ships coming in and out of Earth's airspace that it's just easier to say when you get in system you have to be at impulse. The same thing would be applicable for any of the major star systems that experience large volume traffic.
This is also why you sometimes do see the ships warping in and out of systems. Basicly doesn't mean they can't do it, just that they don't.
A reason for the no intrasystem warp rule could be that such environment has higher particle and debris density, so one risks overloading shields systems and the main deflector has much more work to do.
One guesses the best direction to get out of that would be up or down the solar system plane (disc).
Ah, another model suffering from DNS (Drooping Nacelle Syndrome), just like the old AMT models of the TOS Enterprise. Must be a genetic or hereditary thing.
Actually no. They don't droop at all.
Those pictures are a VERY poor representation of the actual shipping product.
The ship is a light eggshell grey color, and the nacelles are perfectly aligned.
For playmates, this was an amazingly well constructed release. Not as good as Art Asylum, but pretty close.
Those pictures are a VERY poor representation of the actual shipping product.
The ship is a light eggshell grey color, and the nacelles are perfectly aligned.
For playmates, this was an amazingly well constructed release. Not as good as Art Asylum, but pretty close.
Not all of them Dark Overlord. Some of the ones I've seen online definitely have a slight droop to one nacelle. I got lucky with mine, though there was one production difficulty. On my Enterprise, the saucer has a slight upwards tilt and slightly to port as well. But my AA TWOK 1701 has a similar problem, so it's okay.
Also size-wise, the JJ 1701 toy is comparable to the above mentioned 1701. Except for a slight difference in thickness(which I beleive is because the thing's a toy), the saucers are exactly the same size. The engineering hulls are about the same size, the JJ's a little longer because of the physical dish. The engines of the JJ 1701 are actually SHORTER than the AA TWOK 1701, which surprised me. Everything's just brought closer to the ship's "center of gravity" which provides a smaller profile, which means the ship would actually be harder to hit. But the amount of lights on this thing is amazing, far better than Playmates' previous ships and, dare I say, better than even Art Asylum. My only complaint is that there isn't a "lights only" feature.
But now I think we should wait for Tobias and see if he has anything new for us.
Funny how the thread get sometimes a life on its own. I like that
No visual news yet. The movie is finished now. I had to do the sound effects myself, that took 2 days off my last week, so I havenAât done much changes except some rerenderings where I spotted errors. I changed the warpout effect slightly - more, thinner tentacles. YouAâll see when I upload the movie to Youtube (next weekend)...
Sounds like good news Tobias, but may I ask, will there be a high res version available for download after Fed Con(since I know that's what this movie is really for)?
Posts
It would have been fun to actually use those, but the quality is just to horrible.
OneBuckFilms - please shoot me an email. Thanks!
Because there is absolutely nothing sound about this design in any way. All you have to do is look at where the warp pylons meet the nacelles... what horrible placement! It totally ignores the center of balance or gravity on the nacelles, which are morbidly obese to begin with.
I would assume that this is part of the reason why every 1701 after the TOS Connie, including the TMP refit, had the pylons positioned closer to the middle of the nacelles... because it was structurally better that way.
But, as is the case with all your models, Tobias, you're doing a great job, with the material you have to work with.
I figured as much, but just thought I'd point it out. And let's face it, Playmates has never been very high quality anyways.
What does center of gravity have to do with anything on a SPACE ship? If we're going to get into that, every Enterprise has been extraordinarily top heavy for no reason.
Or the -B. That had a tiny saucer, compared to its' engineering hull.
Star Trek Wallpaper Pictures: Official Movie Site
edit - found the link on drexfiles by the way.
The majority of the ships look to be simple kitbashes...
I was imagining the effect looking a bit like that, and as the ship slows, the light beams go from facing forward to behind and start to fade.
And as much as I like the new look of the Big-E, I wish they had put some hull markings on the underside of the saucer. Just doesn't look right without them.
The argument about the placement and structure of the warp pylons is kind of pointless since we're talking science fiction here and any excuse can be made up as to why or how things work. The fact is, though, that even though objects are weightless in space they still have mass. And if you're going to attach one object to another, you'd better be sure the more massive object is held in place well or your spaceship won't stay together for very long, especially if it's going to be moving at high speed. Remember, mass increases as speed increases, even in space. if the supports aren't strong enough, the more massive pieces will tear the ship apart. So, again, as much as I like the new design the pylons don't look like they can support the mass of the warp engines. Since we're not likely to get a detailed explanation about the ship's structure in the film, the audience has only visual clues to go by and if something doesn't look right they'll notice, even if only on an instinctive level. It would have been better to slide the upper edge of the pylons back a bit toward the center of the engines.
Because unlike those other Enterprises, this one is built on the ground for some reason - and has to have a way to get from the ground and into space.
For a more real-world example take the Space Shuttle. If you look at the angle of the Main engines, they follow a line through the center of gravity of the Shuttle/External Tank configuration. The OMS engines follow a center of gravity line of just the orbiter itself.
There are also other considerations. Larger masses close to the center of gravity/thrust move the center less than a mass further out. For the Enterprise, this means that the Warp engines are closer to the center of gravity than the engineering hull and they balance each other out. Since we only have the volumes to go by, and not the mass, it is hard to tell exactly where the center of gravity of the entire ship would really be.
They were NOT red. Have you ever actually WATCHED TOS?? They were red for "The Cage" and "Where No Man Has Gone Before," but I'm afraid that they WERE orange-flickering-rotating-blinking.
In TMP, the deflector actually is "copper" when powered down and never really glowed blue until they hit warp (and got stuck in that wormhole). From then on it was pretty much blue.
Actually, according to several sources they actually attempted several of the battle sequences in Wrath without sound ... but the test audiences thought there was something wrong. So, they added the sound back in.
The Deflector on the TMP Enterprise is white when off and then copper during startup and finally blue
Actually, if you look at it carefully, there is no white or copper. The off color is translucent grey. The startup color is yellow. And actually, only the photage shot for TMP ever shows any yellow. The TMP Enterprise has no paint on the translucent resin. The color comes from how it is illuminated.
The statement you refer to is from TMP and comes from Isaac Asimov who served as science advisor. The only way it makes sense is if it is a Starfleet regulation like the no fly zone over the White House.
A good example of why it isn't a rule in the Trek universe is 'The Naked Time' where the Enterprise warps away from the planet and hurtles back in time (the time travel was due to the cold start, not the planet's gravity according to the episode). In The Voyage Home the Bird of Prey warps around the sun. In Star Trek III the Enterprise warps away from the Excelsior just outside of Space Dock (no time distortion on this one at all). I'm sure there are other examples, but these should do for a start.
This is also why you sometimes do see the ships warping in and out of systems. Basicly doesn't mean they can't do it, just that they don't.
One guesses the best direction to get out of that would be up or down the solar system plane (disc).
Actually no. They don't droop at all.
Those pictures are a VERY poor representation of the actual shipping product.
The ship is a light eggshell grey color, and the nacelles are perfectly aligned.
For playmates, this was an amazingly well constructed release. Not as good as Art Asylum, but pretty close.
Not all of them Dark Overlord. Some of the ones I've seen online definitely have a slight droop to one nacelle. I got lucky with mine, though there was one production difficulty. On my Enterprise, the saucer has a slight upwards tilt and slightly to port as well. But my AA TWOK 1701 has a similar problem, so it's okay.
Also size-wise, the JJ 1701 toy is comparable to the above mentioned 1701. Except for a slight difference in thickness(which I beleive is because the thing's a toy), the saucers are exactly the same size. The engineering hulls are about the same size, the JJ's a little longer because of the physical dish. The engines of the JJ 1701 are actually SHORTER than the AA TWOK 1701, which surprised me. Everything's just brought closer to the ship's "center of gravity" which provides a smaller profile, which means the ship would actually be harder to hit. But the amount of lights on this thing is amazing, far better than Playmates' previous ships and, dare I say, better than even Art Asylum. My only complaint is that there isn't a "lights only" feature.
But now I think we should wait for Tobias and see if he has anything new for us.
No visual news yet. The movie is finished now. I had to do the sound effects myself, that took 2 days off my last week, so I havenAât done much changes except some rerenderings where I spotted errors. I changed the warpout effect slightly - more, thinner tentacles. YouAâll see when I upload the movie to Youtube (next weekend)...