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AnimationChris2005's Stuff

1246774

Posts

  • Dr-TimelordDr-Timelord0 Posts: 0Member
    Aww that sucks :(


    But how did they film the ship in TMP, against blackscreen?
  • wjasperswjaspers171 Posts: 0Member
    Aww that sucks :(


    But how did they film the ship in TMP, against blackscreen?

    Yes they did, and still had to lower the lights on the model. The opalescence can be seen in some of the shots, but the model was much better looking in reality.
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnU9AVpcy8k

    :D

    All weapon based effects, except for the light element on the hull, done in AE.

    attachment.php?attachmentid=46375&d=1298883279
  • BuckaroohawkBuckaroohawk1 Posts: 0Member
    I've always wondered how the "phaser cannons" on the Reliant could fire sideways, since on the model they look to be locked in the forward position. I would have preferred to see them use the phaser batteries on the primary hull instead. That little film nitpick aside, this short clip looks pretty good, though I think the phaser blasts need to be less sharp. They're too well-defined as it stands right now.
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    I've always wondered how the "phaser cannons" on the Reliant could fire sideways, since on the model they look to be locked in the forward position. I would have preferred to see them use the phaser batteries on the primary hull instead. That little film nitpick aside, this short clip looks pretty good, though I think the phaser blasts need to be less sharp. They're too well-defined as it stands right now.

    Well, here they are from the movie:
    twokhd0446.jpg

    twokhd0447.jpg
  • Dr-TimelordDr-Timelord0 Posts: 0Member
    I think what he means and what I think too is, if the Reliant was going to broadside the Enterprise, why not use the phaser cannons on the bottom saucer section.
    Like the Enterprise does in the Mutra Nebula battle later.

    Maybe it didnt look dramatic enough
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    I think what he means and what I think too is, if the Reliant was going to broadside the Enterprise, why not use the phaser cannons on the bottom saucer section.
    Like the Enterprise does in the Mutra Nebula battle later.

    Maybe it didnt look dramatic enough

    Whose to know... only the director, etc. will known, or maybe they wanted to show off what those were there for on the Reliant...
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member

    Just a complete version of the previous preview post...

    Version 2 of this preview:
  • Polaris 004Polaris 004199 Posts: 752Member
    I've always wondered how the "phaser cannons" on the Reliant could fire sideways, since on the model they look to be locked in the forward position. I would have preferred to see them use the phaser batteries on the primary hull instead. That little film nitpick aside, this short clip looks pretty good, though I think the phaser blasts need to be less sharp. They're too well-defined as it stands right now.

    I always imagined that there was a firing arc created by hardware inside the cannon's tube, possibly working on a principal similar to how the Next gen phasers could emit at different angles off of the firing strip. Same sort of thing, but more limited. It would certainly make the cannons more useful in a battle situation, but it does sorta suggest the question "why the cannon shape at all then, if the beam could just be re-directed at the las instant? Maybe the reaction needs a straight tunnel to "powerup" the phaser beam, but it can then be re-directed at the mouth of the barrel.

    As far as why use those cannons to broadside Enterprise instead of the saucer phasers? I always imagined that those phasers were more powerful than the saucer banks, which was why they were mounted there in the first place-- extra fire power. Spock States that the Reliant could still out run and ou tgun Enterprise at the final battle in the nebula. Granted, that may have had to do with the damage Enterprise had sustained earlier, but I still always supposed those guns were mounted there for some extra punch. It was probably much easier to cripple Enterprise using those, than the saucer phasers. And in any case. Maybe Reliant DID use the saucer phasers to do some damage to other systems on that first pass. Khan may have used or neede all his cannons to full disable Enterprise.
  • Dr-TimelordDr-Timelord0 Posts: 0Member
    Your lighting between the two ships doesn't match,
    The enterprise is light way too bright, it looks uniform white instead of the more colourful grey.
    The camera and ship animations are pretty close to the movie, but you should take this opportunity to do some stuff that they were not able to add due to lack of time or money constants.

    Add in some orange glows against both hulls when the phaser bursts passes over them, If you darken the overall lighting, the impact shots on the enterprise hull will flash against the ship, very dynamic.
    Maybe even showing the Enterprise forced to list to starboard slightly because of the impact from the phaser burst? Certainly add in a camera shake of some sort
    It would help match the Impact of the ship, with what is being seen on the bridge. The Ship has been hit pretty hard, and on the console it shows that the ship has been rocked slightly to starboard with this huge BAM!
    Shame they didn't add it into the actual film, but you have a chance to expand upon what is on screen, and what they might do now if they tweaked the film with CGI

    Also you dont have to do this, but Could you render an image of the phaser burst across the engineering hull, but show it from a different angle? Like from frontal view?

    I would just like to see how the enterprise being shot at would appear from a different angle
  • BuckaroohawkBuckaroohawk1 Posts: 0Member
    Chris2005 wrote: »
    Well, here they are from the movie:

    I'll be darned! For some reason I thought they were blurred more than that, with less definition between the hot beam and the surrounding glow. I was obviously mistaken. My apologies. Looking forward to seeing what's next!
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    Your lighting between the two ships doesn't match,

    Neither does the movie.
    The enterprise is light way too bright, it looks uniform white instead of the more colourful grey.

    I suppose I could add a color correction to the Enterprise element in AE, but I could never get it to look quite right... I tried with lights in max, etc.

    Well, back in the 80s, a lot of miniature shots seemed to have a washed out look... thus lower contrast, and I'm not sure if the Enterprise was shot against a blue screen... could account for the slight blue hue to the shot...
    The camera and ship animations are pretty close to the movie, but you should take this opportunity to do some stuff that they were not able to add due to lack of time or money constants.

    Well, I'm trying to be true to the original movie shots, the best I can, without changing angles, etc.
    Add in some orange glows against both hulls when the phaser bursts passes over them, If you darken the overall lighting, the impact shots on the enterprise hull will flash against the ship, very dynamic.

    I'll see what I can do...
    Maybe even showing the Enterprise forced to list to starboard slightly because of the impact from the phaser burst? Certainly add in a camera shake of some sort

    It would help match the Impact of the ship, with what is being seen on the bridge. The Ship has been hit pretty hard, and on the console it shows that the ship has been rocked slightly to starboard with this huge BAM!

    I could prolly add a wiggle controller in AE, to add some shake, but I don't want a JJ Abrams effect.
    Shame they didn't add it into the actual film, but you have a chance to expand upon what is on screen, and what they might do now if they tweaked the film with CGI

    Also you dont have to do this, but Could you render an image of the phaser burst across the engineering hull, but show it from a different angle? Like from frontal view?

    I would just like to see how the enterprise being shot at would appear from a different angle

    I'd have to do a lot of re-arrangement in AE, because the explosions, and phaser hits are 2D objects, well, the phasers are 3D layers, but in a sense are only 2D layers in depth.
  • Polaris 004Polaris 004199 Posts: 752Member
    If Reliant is broadsiding enterprise, and it looks darker from the front, then it only stands to reason Enterprise would look brighter, since the light source seems to be behind Reliant. I don't know what light source that would be, as they are in the middle of space, but the visual continuity is there nonetheless. I guess I would make Enterprise a LITTLE less lit, but I actually prefer a brighter, cleaner look. It also highlights the "good Guy, Bad Guy" visual tracking of the sequence.

    I think the trouble is, you are significantly improving the visual look of the sequence, but to us fans it's always going to seem "wrong" because we are used to the washed out colors and contrast problems that we have been looking at for thirty years. I think you are going to have a very difficult time pleasing many of the fans. (Not this one, though. I think it's awesome.)

    The original phaser streaks are MUCH cheesier than we remember, once we really look at them. It's just that there's so much awesome up on the screen with them that we can't notice. I like your streaks, but I personally would elongate them a bit.
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    If Reliant is broadsiding enterprise, and it looks darker from the front, then it only stands to reason Enterprise would look brighter, since the light source seems to be behind Reliant. I don't know what light source that would be, as they are in the middle of space, but the visual continuity is there nonetheless. I guess I would make Enterprise a LITTLE less lit, but I actually prefer a brighter, cleaner look. It also highlights the "good Guy, Bad Guy" visual tracking of the sequence.

    I think the trouble is, you are significantly improving the visual look of the sequence, but to us fans it's always going to seem "wrong" because we are used to the washed out colors and contrast problems that we have been looking at for thirty years. I think you are going to have a very difficult time pleasing many of the fans. (Not this one, though. I think it's awesome.)

    The original phaser streaks are MUCH cheesier than we remember, once we really look at them. It's just that there's so much awesome up on the screen with them that we can't notice. I like your streaks, but I personally would elongate them a bit.

    I might elongate them, in a v2 of this sequence, I've redone this single Enterprise impact shot, like 3 times already, lol.

    Speaking of versions, here is version 3 of this particular shot:
  • Polaris 004Polaris 004199 Posts: 752Member
    Yeah, I don't know that it would be worth the trouble; it really is an excellent sequence as it is. I think you are about at the point of diminishing returns on your effort.
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    I think you are about at the point of diminishing returns on your effort.

    What do you mean?
  • Polaris 004Polaris 004199 Posts: 752Member
    I mean from this point on any changes you make will make a certain number of viewers happier, and a certain number of viewers less happy with the results. And the number of viewers who are less pleased are likely to be a number equal to or greater than those more pleased. Diminishing returns. Of course, if you see the opportunity to make YOURSELF more pleased with some aspect of the scene, then that is ALWAYS worthwhile...
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    Well, this will be my only completed sequence of this project... I've been told to cease using Al's Reliant... sorry folks.
  • Dr-TimelordDr-Timelord0 Posts: 0Member
    You have , how come?


    I thought if artists are given proper credit in vids or pics, and you downloaded the mesh from a public site, you cant really be told off for using it?

    I could be wrong though
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    You have , how come?

    I thought if artists are given proper credit in vids or pics, and you downloaded the mesh from a public site, you cant really be told off for using it?

    I could be wrong though

    I thought the same thing, according to what I'm told Al's EULA along with it's hosted website, that only members of where it was released can use the model, and that website is a private members only website, of which I'm banned from, for countless ludicrous reasons, and since KnightRider converted them to Max and sent me them, but even if I was a member, which I was, I couldn't use them, until KnightRider had converted them, anyway, because they are made in Lightwave...
  • BuckaroohawkBuckaroohawk1 Posts: 0Member
    Sorry to hear that you can't use the Reliant model for your vids anymore, Chris. I guess I can understand the reasoning as you explained it. If it's a private site and they only want other members to have access to the models, that's their choice. Of course, that should be explained on the site itself, as well as in a .txt file included with all the available models when they're downloaded. It should also be made clear that converting the models to other formats is forbidden unless the person who built it gives permission.

    Personally, I couldn't care less. I have some models available on this site (which is also members-only), and if people want to convert them to other formats and upload them here, make improvements, pass them along to friends, or whatever...it's all fine with me as long as they credit me as the original modeller. I made them so they can be enjoyed by as many people as possible and if members of this site can help with that, as far as I'm concerned it's all good.

    Anyway, here's hoping you can find another Relaint model to complete the remaining scenes. It may not be as good as the one you've been using, but good texturing and creative lighting can hide a multitude of sins. Best of luck to you!
  • Toa_KaitaToa_Kaita171 Posts: 0Member
    Hey, heres an idea. You did a fantastic job of using WileyCoyote's Excelsior in your Klingon Weapon movie. It actually looked quite realistic. Why not use his Reliant in your animations?
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    Sorry to hear that you can't use the Reliant model for your vids anymore, Chris. I guess I can understand the reasoning as you explained it. If it's a private site and they only want other members to have access to the models, that's their choice. Of course, that should be explained on the site itself, as well as in a .txt file included with all the available models when they're downloaded. It should also be made clear that converting the models to other formats is forbidden unless the person who built it gives permission.

    Personally, I couldn't care less. I have some models available on this site (which is also members-only), and if people want to convert them to other formats and upload them here, make improvements, pass them along to friends, or whatever...it's all fine with me as long as they credit me as the original modeller. I made them so they can be enjoyed by as many people as possible and if members of this site can help with that, as far as I'm concerned it's all good.

    Anyway, here's hoping you can find another Relaint model to complete the remaining scenes. It may not be as good as the one you've been using, but good texturing and creative lighting can hide a multitude of sins. Best of luck to you!

    Well, Rolliba allowed me to use his Reliant, and it's actually, more accurate, in terms of the nacelle form, etc. from what I see, but it's a mighty model in terms of geometry, renders fast, though.

    Well, apparently Al is very protective of his models... from what I've heard, and the fact that I have it before approval of a conversion release, despite their having been a Lightwave release, within the website it was released on, and that non-members aren't allowed to have it, even though there is no harm in my having it, as I don't plan on doing anything obscene with it, etc.
    Toa_Kaita wrote: »
    Hey, heres an idea. You did a fantastic job of using WileyCoyote's Excelsior in your Klingon Weapon movie. It actually looked quite realistic. Why not use his Reliant in your animations?

    Interesting idea, but most of the details on it are textures...
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member

    WileyCoyote does know I (have) convert(ed) some of his models to use, he's commented on my Excelsior and Excelsior refit conversions of his models video a while back, and that it's nice to see his Excelsior in action, but he gave no complaints as to their use or lack thereof, if anyone is unaware, they're actually made for Bridge Commander a PC game, considering it's age, some people don't know what that is, especially if you're not frequent gamer.

    Can be seen here:
    http://www.youtube.com/comment_servlet?threaded=1&all_comments=1&v=LBe6VfXb-BY

    All the texturing, and most of the smoothing done, welding of vertices to remove the segmentation of the geometry, and I might remove certain parts of the self illumination map, to add actual max lights, like the spot lights, to give more realistic specular panel hits, etc. as well as the beacons, and all the other pretty flashing lights, lol.

    'Star Trek' AR & Ac 2011 CBS Studios Inc. All Rights Reserved.
    88089.png
  • Capt DaveCapt Dave0 Posts: 0Member
    Cool. So can we expect more?
  • Chris2005Chris2005374 Posts: 2,988Member
    Capt Dave wrote: »
    Cool. So can we expect more?

    Yes.
  • Toa_KaitaToa_Kaita171 Posts: 0Member
    Wow! She looks fantastic! :D
  • StarshipStarship235 São Paulo - BrasilPosts: 1,760Member
    Willey is one of the bests when talking about low and medium polly meshes. The conversion is coming along very nice. :)
  • ChanurChanur191 53.33° N / 10.00° EPosts: 305Member
    Hm, very nice!
    About how many polys are we talking in this case?
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