3DTOS Enterprise

Elokim-Supreme

Well, after a really long time which I didn't have any time to make new stuff (or any stuff at all...)
I finaly had some time (I finaly finished my first degree in marine biology), so I decided to refresh my memory with one of my favorites - the TOS Enterprise...

Buckaroohawk

The shape looks good, except there seems to be a cut-in or dent running around the rim of the saucer. Whose blueprints are you using for reference? They look familiar, but they aren't Franz Joseph's. I can't place who did them or where I've seen them before.

Elokim-Supreme

I used this bluprints. I know they pretty suck and I don't know why I didn't look for better ones :rolleyes:
What are these Franz Joseph's blueprints you talked about?! I am looking for a good blueprint of the galaxy class starship.

[Deleted User]

I wouldn't say 'they suck'. They are quite good, actually, for what they are.

They aren't intended to be engineering drawings, but to show the basic idea better than a simple sketch. They also have one other thing.

Measurements. Now as you know, if you have taken any drafting courses, the drawing is an approximation to what is to be, or what is. The meansurements are what is expected exactly. To some level of tolerance. So they are okay.

What FJ did was to take it to the next level. By Hand. Not having access to cheap computers, and drawing programs.

Now as to the quality of your work, it is pretty good for a start.

[Deleted User]

These are the best TOS Enterprise blueprints I have ever seen: http://www.angelfire.com/scifi2/wizardofflight/TOS1701.html

Buckaroohawk

Franz Joseph drew up extremely detailed blueprints of the Constitution Class vessel (the class to which the Enterprise belongs) way back in the 1970s, outlining the layout of every deck in both profile and overhead. As Nick R. pointed out, he did this all by hand, as there were no CGI or CADD computer programs then. Despite many inconsistencies with the filming model used for the original "Star Trek" TV show, Joseph's blueprints are still highly regarded by many Trek fans, if for no other reason than their stunning detail. He also wrote and illustrated the Star Trek Technical Manual, which introduced many other classes of Starfleet vessels.

For a good discussion about Joseph's blueprints, I suggest you read through this thread that appears on this very site:
http://www.scifi-meshes.com/forums/showthread.php?60485-USS-Enterprise-NCC1701-Deck-by-Deck..

I also suggest you do a Google search on Franz Joseph to get more information. I think you'll be surprised by what you find.

Elokim-Supreme

Thanks guys!
Buckaroohawk - I saw this thread, it is an amazing work!
I did A little search yestersay and I came across this site:
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/star-trek-unnamed.php
Are you familiar with these blueprints?

[Deleted User]

If you look at the drawing you started with, you will see the intended positions of the Phasers. But, and here is where the drawing is in error, there is no indecation for the upper phasers. There should be at least four phasers shown. Now if you look below the bridge, where the command hull is, you will see two little bumps. I keep asking myself, are these phasers? If they are they should have call outs to that effect. but they don't.

You see the problem is that with only one set of phasers ever shown firing, the ship if it were real has too many gunnery blind spots...

This is one reason I like the ENT episode, In a Mirror Darkly they the artists et el, took care of the problem in part.

Buckaroohawk

Elokim-Supreme wrote: »

Thanks guys!
Buckaroohawk - I saw this thread, it is an amazing work!
I did A little search yestersay and I came across this site:
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/star-trek-unnamed.php
Are you familiar with these blueprints?

As a matter of fact, that site is on my Favorites list. I've used it many times for reference or to get some ideas for my own builds. There are a lot of conjectural blueprints, cutaways, and schematics on the site. Every Trek fan has their own ideas about what goes where inside the ship and what certain exterior details might be. Some of them are very well thought-out, though in almost every instance there is evidence within the episodes of TOS or the movies that contradict them. When it comes to stuff like that my philosophy is "do what you think is best and makes the most sense to you." There's no law that says your Enterprise must look exactly like the filming model or even someone else's design. That's one of the really great things about the Enterprise; it's a vessel of imagination and you can shape it into something uniquely your own.

I'm looking forward to seeing more as your build progresses. Best of luck!

publiusr

I think somebody also did some model that was accurate to these blueprints, and a CGI model true to these sketches would have its own charm.
FJs big blueprint pack had the secondary hull quite fluidly designed--and was made into a model for a big Franklin minit mini (white paint)

This sketch has the secondary hull even longer, rather like what we saw in TAS. So keep up the good work.

Something to to to make your work even more distinctive. Have the model painfully white and glossy, and have heavy black lines atop and beneath so as to have the sketch lines stand out.

[Deleted User]

No, the secondary hull has always been 340' long. And 112' in diameter. Which is interesting. One hundred and twelve feet, is the size of a eleven story building, and the Primary hull happens to be eleven decks thick, through the middle. The corralation is that the primary hull is also 112' high... By convention, unless I am totally off.

publiusr

I was just eyebaling the sketch.

The TOS secondary hull has been drawn in different ways. FJ had the secondary hull in a teardrop shape even before Probert went that route, though Shaw and others has it more or less flat as the actual model seems to be. The art Asylum Diamond TOS Enterprise toys will even stand upon the secondary hull all on their own without the stand, though be careful. Thomas Sasser did the research for that IIRC.

In FJs big set of plans, the bulb of the secondary hull bottom is near the dish--here with the sketches above, the secondary hull appears even more elegant, and the saucer less blocky than on his big sheet of prints.

You know, I don't think anyone has done a Mesh of the AMT model when finished. It has its own lines that are different than FJs.

Elokim-Supreme

Ok... so I finished with the modelling (or at least I would like to think so...) and started texturing.
I still can't get the unwraping right and I have no idea how to create a good "starship" material (*cough* could use some help *cough*).

Buckaroohawk

There are so many websites out there with references, articles, and examples of how to create material maps for spaceship hulls. A few of them actually deal exclusively with trek ships. Heck, there may even be a few right here. Check the "Dojo" forum area and see if anything pops up there.

All you really need is a photomanipulation program (like Photoshop, CorelDraw, or CorelPaint) and a few decent photos of the Enterprise itself; either the original filming model or one of the many physical or CGI fan-made models. After that it's all up to you to decide what your version should look like. Panel lines on the saucer or not? Aztec hull plating, a more random design, or perhaps none at all. Should the hull have a blue tint like it did in the FX shots from the show, or the more brownish-green color of the actual model? try a few different looks and decide what you think looks best. Good luck!

Elokim-Supreme

Finally, after lots of hours and much frustration, I managed to get the uvw map right on the hull. now.. for me it is still a mystery... when I'm drawing the textures, how do I get the seams to match?

Buckaroohawk

If you're talking about mapping a cylinder (like the secondary hull in the image above), what I usually do is create a map that will fit 1/2 of the cylinder, from the center of the top to the center of the bottom. Then I do one of two things: 1. If the markings are identical on both sides of the cylinder I use a planar map frame that runs the length of the cylinder from front to back. The map will automatically be mirrored on the other side of the object.
2. If there are differences to the markings (like lettering, for instance), then I copy and paste the 1/2 map and flip the copy so the details that will appear at the top of the cylinder are on the outisde edges of the map. I make whatever changes are necessary to the map, then add it to the object using a cylindircal map frame. If you've lined up both halves of the map correctly it should appear seamless at the top of the object. It takes some trial and error and I've made more than my fair share of mistakes doing this, but sticking with it usually results in some nice looking work. Hope this helps!

Elokim-Supreme

This is the map that I'm using. I used a cylinder map to unwrap it and than made a few stiching to make it more easy to use. now.. as you can sea the part that surrounded by a blue line is the top of the hull and the part that surrounded by red is the bottom. let's say that I make some kind of random plating or dirt. at the top of the hull, I won't have any problems because the left side and the right side are connected. but what about the bottom? how can i make it continue accuretly and smoothly without a mismatch?

b.t.w
Buckaroohawk - I had an idea when I red your post again. maybe thats what you ment - if I'm drawing half pf the hull and than flip it (in photoshop), any random patterns should be exactly the same on the other side and than all I need is to work on the flipped side and change it a bit so it won't be exactly the same as the other side and leave only the bottom where the two sides should be matching. am I right? is that what you ment, just in different words?

Elokim-Supreme

Ok... so I made a few tests with the texture... this is what I got so far.

Elokim-Supreme

ok... this is what I got so far...

I have a problem with the Meshsmooth modifier. When I turn it on it distorts the texture.
I'm using meshsmooth with smoothing groups. I checked the smoothing groups and they are fine.

Melak

meshsmooth also smooths the UVs, but that wrinkle only happening on one side looks weird, can you show a collapsed wireframe view?

Elokim-Supreme

here are the wire frames

Elokim-Supreme

Ok... I thought this part would be the easiest one of the texturing process. It seems that I am wrong.
I'm having difficulty mapping the side of the saucer. the top and bottom are simply planar maps. I tried using a cylindrical map on the sides, it looks good but it get streched and I can't put all of it as one part cause it just dont fit the texture map properly (it's too big, unless I distort it's proportions).

I'm adding the texture map i'm currently using...

Buckaroohawk

I've had the same problem with my Enterprise builds as well. My solution was the make the edge of the saucer its own object (either a cylinder or a tube) and make the top and bottom of the saucer separate objects as well. This way you can make a map for the edge and place it using a cylindrical map marker and still use planar maps on the top and bottom.

publiusr

Here is some data on the 33 inch enterprise by Shaw
http://federationreference.prophpbb.com/post8272.html
He has research showing that Datin and Jefferies mounted nacelles differently.

Elokim-Supreme

I did some progress today... Started to test materials and lightning...

Starkiller

Lookin' good so far! I am not looking forward to UVmapping mine.
How are you doing on your Connie's UVing? Any problems?

Eric

Elokim-Supreme

Thanks Starkiller!
I'm Still having problem with the saucer. I tried to separate the side of the saucer from the top and the bottom, but it didn't work. It seems that no matter what map I use - the texture always get distorted. finally I broke the side to four pieces and relaxed them a bit so the distortion won't be so obvious. it will be easy to make the windows but I will need to find a solution to all the details that run across the entire saucer (like lines).

b.t.w - I changed the map from above. I will post it later cause I'm not infront my PC.

Elokim-Supreme

ok.. as you can see I added lights and decals.
Starkiller - it turned out that the uv mapping of the sides of the saucer is ok.
Buckaroohawk - thanks for the advice!

Elokim-Supreme

Update.. I finishd the part between the saucer and the secondery hull. now i started working on the nacelles. I must thank Madkoifish for his tuts!

Elokim-Supreme

texturing the nacelles. I have a problem with the shadows created by the bussards. how can I resolve this?

Elokim-Supreme

the deflector dish.