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Children of Sol WIPs

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Posts

  • salsasalsa0 Posts: 0Member
    ...
    whoa. That. is. awesome.
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Hi Guys, I'm going to be broadcasting a live modelling session in about 2 hours, drop in to see how I set up my scene, create mock up models and add detail. It's also a chance for the pro's to critique me and give advice to others in the channel.

    For more information, please check out this link. http://mformethod.com/comm/index.php?/topic/55-live-ustream-modelling-webcast/
  • markmasseymarkmassey176 Posts: 285Member
    this is a great thread well done. keep up the sterling work....
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Thanks Markmassey.

    Broadcasting live now, for the next few hours, join me here...
    http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-modelling-session
  • IRMLIRML232 Posts: 1,980Member
    ah this is cool, it kind of has a homeworld feel to the details and scale, just a bit more rounded, which is awesome
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    This was the progress of the model when I ended the stream.
    plug-3-b.jpg
  • dwldwl0 Posts: 0Member
    I like the style of this series of ships. As IRML mentioned they have that same vibe as the Homeworld ships. Different style but same kind of familiar-but-alien atmosphere. Good stuff.

    I was very interested to watch your broadcast but I struggled to see much. The broadcast video was quite low res; was difficult to make things out. Apart from your cinematic dualscreen setup :) Audio was good, crisp and clear. Chat was account based, which made me grumble.. sorry.... couldnt even say hello.
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    New month, new ship concepts...

    2 cruisers this time I'm going to try to finish before the end of the month. Going to start with the red one. It's an Asomat drive yards assault cruiser called 'Eos'. The other is a Lyaedia drive yards ghost recon cruiser called 'Yori'.

    This should be another marathon with daily/hourly updates :devil:

    cruiser-concepts.png
  • commandersozocommandersozo177 Posts: 423Member
    looks promising ....with your skills!!!
  • AresiusAresius337 Posts: 4,124Member
    Dang these ships looks amazing, wonderful design and great style! :)
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    eos121.jpg

    Haven't done so much over the last few days, still working on the outer hull.
  • OzylotOzylot0 Posts: 0Member
    Really enjoying your concepts and ships! Very nice!
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Thanks for the comments so far.

    Updates:

    Basic shape resolved, time for a **** load of detailing tomorrow

    eos1-preview.jpg
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    Hello Dreamwa1ker,
    I've always wanted to ask you this, for a year or two or three or so, well, ever since I saw your works at DA. I was that guy who wrote a critique (unaccepted =p) for EVE - Tornado.
    Let me start by saying : your works inspire. They are different. And I respect your artistic talent and the quest for new in sci-fi 3d. Well, you nay have been inspired by somebody or something, but that's crap anyway, we're all inspired by and learn from somebody. This is the bright side. Now I apologize in advance for being a sort of lazy critic schmuck who simply writes and criticizes without showing his own works (well, after this post I'll have to, and I promise to, but that' s not my thread anyway :D), but there are some seemingly small but VERY disgusting modeling, well, errors or inaccuracies, you name it. There's a lot of them in this latest model, Eos, and they're all the same. Now the 1024 words (as opposed to a picture :D) are :
    Suppose you have an organic flow mesh. A smooth, round mesh. Now it has an edge, which is there because the mesh has been obviously extruded, and betweeen the edge and the surface of the mesh is sitting the error. It is as follows : you are obvioulsy using MeshSmooth or TurboSmooth for your models. Now to get a sharp edge, you are using Smoothing Groups. I am sure. Why? Because then you get the polygons perfectly visible, that is, a chain of unsmoothed polygon edges on the border between the surface and the edge of the surface. I recommend you that you actually do the following : simply extrude the edge with one of the parameters set to zero (it's Base and the other parameter, you want Base to be non-zero (it's the width of the stripe) and the other parameter to be zero, so that the new edges stay on the surface.) This will give you a sharp edge when (or after) applying MeshSmooth or TurboSmooth. The Base should be very small. I can provide you with a picture of such an error if you want.

    Forgive me for a lengthy post full of critique and feel free to delete it even - this is to the mods. =p If you were to post such a mesh at say Render.ru (an industry-leading 3D website and forum in Russia), you would get the same reaction in 5 minutes and in very harsh words (Russians are very rude sometimes). You do not see this in SFM, and I love SFM for that. I've tried to be as polite as possible, if critique isn't quite polite in Europe, well, then I'm not quite sure how to convey my thoughts which are completely objective, in my opinion. Thanks for your attention.

    Looking forward to hearing for you,
    Best regards,
    Ignat Semenov aka thorGT
  • colbmistacolbmista0 Posts: 0Member
    thorGT wrote: »
    Hello Dreamwa1ker,
    I've always wanted to ask you this, for a year or two or three or so, well, ever since I saw your works at DA. I was that guy who wrote a critique (unaccepted =p) for EVE - Tornado.
    Let me start by saying : your works inspire. They are different. And I respect your artistic talent and the quest for new in sci-fi 3d. Well, you nay have been inspired by somebody or something, but that's crap anyway, we're all inspired by and learn from somebody. This is the bright side. Now I apologize in advance for being a sort of lazy critic schmuck who simply writes and criticizes without showing his own works (well, after this post I'll have to, and I promise to, but that' s not my thread anyway :D), but there are some seemingly small but VERY disgusting modeling, well, errors or inaccuracies, you name it. There's a lot of them in this latest model, Eos, and they're all the same. Now the 1024 words (as opposed to a picture :D) are :
    Suppose you have an organic flow mesh. A smooth, round mesh. Now it has an edge, which is there because the mesh has been obviously extruded, and betweeen the edge and the surface of the mesh is sitting the error. It is as follows : you are obvioulsy using MeshSmooth or TurboSmooth for your models. Now to get a sharp edge, you are using Smoothing Groups. I am sure. Why? Because then you get the polygons perfectly visible, that is, a chain of unsmoothed polygon edges on the border between the surface and the edge of the surface. I recommend you that you actually do the following : simply extrude the edge with one of the parameters set to zero (it's Base and the other parameter, you want Base to be non-zero (it's the width of the stripe) and the other parameter to be zero, so that the new edges stay on the surface.) This will give you a sharp edge when (or after) applying MeshSmooth or TurboSmooth. The Base should be very small. I can provide you with a picture of such an error if you want.

    Forgive me for a lengthy post full of critique and feel free to delete it even - this is to the mods. =p If you were to post such a mesh at say Render.ru (an industry-leading 3D website and forum in Russia), you would get the same reaction in 5 minutes and in very harsh words (Russians are very rude sometimes). You do not see this in SFM, and I love SFM for that. I've tried to be as polite as possible, if critique isn't quite polite in Europe, well, then I'm not quite sure how to convey my thoughts which are completely objective, in my opinion. Thanks for your attention.

    Looking forward to hearing for you,
    Best regards,
    Ignat Semenov aka thorGT

    looks fine to me
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    colbmista wrote: »
    looks fine to me

    Believe me, it doesn't. Please let Dreamwa1ker himself answer the question. I may provide a picture to prove what I mean, no problem, but let's not hijack this thread and wait for the official answer. Look closely with the full-size picture and you'll see it.
    eos-mesh-poly-error-example.jpg

    See? Still think it's ok? ;) That's a beginner's sort of error, to start with, to be honest with you, colbmista, which I believe Dreamwa1ker in no way is. He simply doesn't pay attention to this level of detail, which is sad. Because it does spoil the impression a lot for anybody at least distantly familiar with the principles of 3d polygonal modeling. Again, I apologize if you can't say things like that in Europe. I'm Russian. ;)

    Heck....................... I've got it.............................. he doesn't use MeshSmooth at all!!!!!!! Look pic 2 from bottom! Dreamwa1ker, how can you? You're giving the preview to us and it then remains the same in the final model? I've seen it in Varuna, and Tornado, and somewhere else, and that was release, not beta version! (Now all I really hope for is your sense of humor, but anyway, what I'm saying is serious)

    eos-mesh-poly-error-example-2.jpg
    Proof. Impossible, but true. No MeshSmooth. Only Smoothing Groups. Well, that still kinda qualifies for a middle poly model. :(
    85857.jpg85858.jpg
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    And colbmista, thank you for reading all that long critical crap o'mine. You're brave. Really. :p
  • MelakMelak171 Posts: 0Member
    I don't mean to speak for dreamwalker, but here goes nothing:
    Have you looked at any of his other models?
    Because that, and him saying "basic shape resolved" makes me pretty confident to say what he's showing is the base mesh, with no meshsmoothing applied.
    Of course, I could also be very wrong :)
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Yeah, I use smoothing groups, and turbo smooth and in those initial images there where plenty of mesh errors.

    I used to 'double chamfer" a lot a few years ago underneath a turbo smooth stack but it often caused more issues than it solved. These days I work on a basic mesh before permanently sub-dividing and correcting mesh errors, which is what I did on the Gyoshi. On the tornado, it was pretty low poly (20k triangles) for obvious reasons.

    Anyway, some updates...

    eos1-10-preview.jpg

    Yep, there's still loads of mesh errors and uncorrected smoothing groups.
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    Still, it would be nice of you paid more attention to the (boring) detail. I'll try to be short this time and only say that in a few places you simply have a brick instead of an antenna, and this makes an appearance in the final version sometimes. Also the composition sometimes sucks badly, in my opinion (when you make those f*cking awesome and large-scale battle scenes), but that's subjective, at least. So basically, well, that's it. If you have real mesh problems, I'd be happy to see that and help where I can. I'm a real master of mesh theory. Some academic degree even, like a Ph.D. in 3D modelling :p the thesis was, well, something like "A Study on the Algorithms for the Conversion of Irregular Polygonal Mesh Into Triangles and Quads Using Polynomial Approximation Methods", well, you know, that type of thing. We have Vektor in here, he's the Mr. Mesh Perfect, you know.

    And kudos to the forums for being so polite and optimistic, because in Russia, there are a lot of people of this special kind on the forums, who simply *seek out* for everybody else's errors. You'd not believe that, anyway, but they do exist.
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    I think my point is that I usually correct them as I go through. Usually I start with a low poly model refining and adding detail as I go on. Rarely do I go straight to sub dividing.

    Feel free to nit pick mesh errors, especially before I go to uvw unwrapping. :)
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    Feel free to nit pick mesh errors, especially before I go to uvw unwrapping. :)

    You really have allowed me to do that? You know what it means??? ;)

    Well, just be sure to post often, and it's not always clear when it's a mesh error or not-a-final version, but I'll find everything I can. You may simply forget to detail everything, I understand now, but that's what the forums are for. Waiting for updates.

    *That's what you have to do when you can't get down to modelling yourself because of perfectionism*
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Updates!

    I've still got a surprising amount to do, might take a break till Tuesday, will hope to finish it by Thursday textures and all.

    Bearing in mind the scale of this vessel is cruiser (250m in length), does the detailing and proportion of objects work?
    eos5-preview.jpg
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Oh and yeah, still lots of errors :), too sleepy to deal with it now, feel free to point any out if you see them.
  • somacruz145somacruz1450 Posts: 0Member
    Too detailed :p Seriously, I love all of your ships and I'm sure you will make it perfect with time :D They should be put into the Eve (without a contest of any kind) of course after you got paid !
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    By the way, Dreamwa1ker, did you watercool the 480 you had won? It's one hell of a videocard, you know that anyway already :) Too bad it's not an EVGA, but on water they're all the same.

    Nothing to say close to the topic except for the bricked antenna. Please, that's my personal, erm, petition or request, call it as you want, but make at least one ship with a detailed antenna on the back!
  • dreamwalkerdreamwalker177 Posts: 189Member
    Modelling done!
    eos7-preview.jpg
  • ParkerParker0 Posts: 0Member
    I wont say that this Is the ebst model you ever made ...

    .. because if I do, he next model will be even better. =)

    Great work, as always!
  • MephMeph171 Posts: 0Member
    Woah dude, very cool ship. Looks lean & mean.
  • thorGTthorGT0 Posts: 0Member
    Hey Dreamwa1ker!

    Well, to me this still looks like a draft a bit. Why do you always leave things like this
    detail_claim_1.PNG,
    that is, badly detailed geometry which looks like (forgive me :) ) a pile of random non-functional crap ;)?
    and this
    detail_claim_2.PNG,
    that is, my favorite antenna which is essentially a brick? It's not that small, it's big enough to be seen on a final render by a sharp (and even not-so-sharp ;) like mine) eye. This is my main claim/pretension (not quite sure about the word) to you and my main complaint about your models.

    Now this
    mesh_error.PNG
    looks like a mesh error to me. Not sure, can be lightning.

    Otherwise, perfect job. You seem to have started repeating yourself in the details, namely grills, those plates with two "teeth" stuck into them (like huuuuge hatches with hinges, you know what I mean), while the shape always remains new and refreshing. Remember, for an artist the greatest sin is to repeat themselves or anybody else's work. The latter you newer do, the former you may start doing very soon, however this part remains highly subjective.

    Regards,
    Ignat Semenov aka thorGT
    85905.PNG85906.PNG85907.PNG
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