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  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    This is the beggings of the S.R. Yorganogov class carrier. Yes I know there are alot of ships in this comic. Im going to start working on characters some time this week.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    ok I started the engines on the mig. It will be powered by and Advanced ION drive that hyper-excites the particles as the pass through the grid.

    images removed for space......
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    started the lasers!

    images removed for space....
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    Ok I decided to do some work on the station tonight. Started shaping the ring some more. I started the smallest of the gangways for this station. Layed out a couple in the starboard horse shoe to give an idea of placement and scale. The gangways have a 12 foot radius and are 40 feet long.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    Begun shaping the S.R. attack craft. I was inspired by a kids toy. She will have a crew of two, and Im thinking of giving this bird FTL capability, just sure if that will work for the story.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    a little work before bed.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    ok I screwed up the Mig 145 pretty bad so I decided to start fresh and xame up with something tottaly different, Instead of a canopy that opens there is a hatch to crawl through on this bird.
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    The Mig 145 looks good,
    there are echos of the stealth fighter (from before we really knew what the stealth fighter actually looked like - when we called it the F-19 or something).

    How about the hatch in the belly instead? like the old British Vulcan bombers, or a lower-side hatch like a canberra bomber?
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    I like the bottom hatch idea alot monkey.
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    Actually, scrap what I said about the British Vulcan bomber, as pictures of the belly hatch for crew entry in the B52 and B1 bombers are more readily available.

    But they are just hatches, are you currently thinking simple hatch, or some form of docking collar, like most of the smaller fighters (rarely seen) seemed to have on their bellies in the Firefly TV series (see when they are nearly 'humped' by the alliance cruiser at the start of the pilot)?

    Oh, and after looking at the home page a little closer....Happy Birthday!
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    TY on the happy bday monkey. And you nailed what I want on the hatch. The docking coller type deal on Serenity. know where any good ref pics of her or any other ships from the series are....wel I could just start making some I have the series and movie.

    Im going to move the hatch to the rear of the attack craft and make it a crew hatch, maybe let it carry a few troops into battle if need be.
  • star_creationsstar_creations0 Posts: 0Member
    these jets are looking great....very impressed, i guess my fighter is not that good, I get very little replies, oh well.

    OH, forgot HAPPY B - DAY...and i am redoing the canopy, the other one just my newer canopy will look allot better.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    star I loved that canopy honest
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    kborak wrote: »
    The docking coller type deal on Serenity. know where any good ref pics of her or any other ships from the series are....wel I could just start making some I have the series and movie.

    Ah, no sorry, always seems to be serenity herself people focus on (i' love to find some good references to the alliance crusiers - not the ones from the movie, but the original ones in th series that look like flying city blocks, I thought they were great!)

    I don't have access to my DVDs of firefly, but purely off memory, I don't think we ever get a real good look at the belly of one of those gunships.

    We see them breifly docked upside down to the belly of the Dortmunster (spelling?) as they power up when serenity is detected stealing from the hulk in the start of the pilot.

    I believe one is seen landing in the Ariel (hospital theft) episode, a couple also land in the garden in the Trash episode, and one pursues the serenity in the Message episode (with the friend pretending to be dead) but I don't think we ever get to see their docking collar.

    Likewise the Raptors in BSG are supposed to hace a docking collar of some sorts on their belly - see the episode when there is a coup against Roslin, and a group of raptors with marines attach to the outer hull - but when ever a raptor flys over head, there does not seem to be any sign of a door in the raptor's floor, sorry not much help!

  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    monkey your a well of knowledge it seems good call on the good shots and episodes.

    Im having a dilema on the mig fighter, I dont know if I like what I have going. here is a look at another version. Any votes on which one is liked better?
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    TY for the compliment, but I am not an expert or artistic master, can only comment on what looks good to me.

    I have to say, I prefer the old one: I think with the up-turned canards at the front, there is no need for vertical rudders at the back.
    I also prefer the "patch-work" cockpit transperancies on the old one, even though the new one is almost certainly more practical, the old multi-faceted one has a charm to it; like the clear panels and 'brow' windows in a C130 Hercules transport plane.

    In the new one, are my eyes decieving me, is that three sets of wings? Not real clear on my monitor. Or is it just a 'notch' midway down the main wing?

    Looking at the pilot seated in the new version, not too sure you have scale enough to fit a docking hatch, would you perhaps consider a seat that lowers through the floor like the one fitted to the EDIin the movie 'Stealth'?
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    This is the cockpit transparency for a british Victor bomber, which is the look and feel of the cockpit that I first had when I first saw the old design,

    It also has some vague similarities to the clear panels on the delta flyer too.
  • BerkutBerkut1 Posts: 0Member
    the newer design looks like it has practically no visibility of any area except directly in front of the fighter, plus I think the old versions just looks better, somehow has a mig 1.42 feeling to it

    Word of advice, stop using the meshsmooth modifier, or whatever equivalent of it in your software. Although it may seem like a big shortcut at first, as you keep working you'll find it is completely unusable for anything mechanical, and it doesn't quite look right.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    Monkey the Idea about EDI I love it I almost forgot about that movie Ill see about that one.

    Berkut I think your right about the older one looking more like a mig. But about using turbo smooth Im not sure how I would get that flow in the lines without it. you have any suggestions?
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    Ok in honor of monkey I started the cockpit. Went back to an earlier version of the M-146 and reshaped it a little. Cut out a section and went to work. This is what I have started.
  • BerkutBerkut1 Posts: 0Member
    kborak wrote: »
    Monkey the Idea about EDI I love it I almost forgot about that movie Ill see about that one.

    Berkut I think your right about the older one looking more like a mig. But about using turbo smooth Im not sure how I would get that flow in the lines without it. you have any suggestions?

    It depends on the application. There are a few techniques for getting smooth lines. But right now what I mean is that you'll almost never see a fighter or anything mechanical smooth everywhere


    EDI from stealth as you can see although lines are very smooth, the outline of the fighter is sharp, the top of the engines is sharp and the intakes. It's the same with all modern fighters.

    also when you start going into further detailing a meshsmoothed model is a nightmare to work with

    what 3d app are you using?

    also good start on the cockpit,, gotta lean that seat back a bit though, ever tried to sit in a car at a 90 degree angle? heh
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    @Berkut: If you are looking at a planetary atmospheric plane, then yeah, the seat is usually leaning back (in some cases - like the F-16, it leans back a *lot*), this is because the primary gee force is acting vertically, they are pushed down into the seat during a turn, so you get your head low so that it is easier to pump blood to your brain during a 7g turn. But in a space ship, usually the primary direction of Gee force is from nose to tail, hence if you look at the seating in the Apollo space craft they are seated upright (actually leaning slightly head forward towards the nose)

    However, as this is atmospheric in looks, probably better to go for an atmospheric plane type seat, and lean back a little.

    @Kborak: Maybe if the plane has a sidestick controls, I'd consider having side control panels come down with the seat, but I would have nothing in front of the pilots legs, allow him (her?) to step off easy and to get in he just sits down and leans back - and his ground crew can strap him in, like real astronaughts do,
    leave the front panel up inside the ship. This would also allow you to bring the panel up his thighs, closer to his chest and in easier reach of his arms.

    Not sure if it is just my perspective, but the main gear looks a little far back to the rear, planes usually have their main wheels just behind the point of balance, I think the wheels as they currently are, will have too much weight on the nose wheel.

    The deep keel in the front-on view looks great, very like that old german jet (ME 163 Komet? or something?)
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    @berkut Im using Max 9 You are right there are the sharp angle on aircraft (the fasster the flight speed and the higher the altitude you tend to have sharper edges.) I should counsider making the leading an trailing edges of the wings sharper. But as far as the Fuesalage, if you look at a Mig-29 or F-18 they are both very smooth. I am going to play with the wings a little bit to see what I can do about that. But as the model is now the wings are extruded from the fuesalage. i may have to rebuild the fuesalage and them mate wings that arent turbo smoothed to it. And your right detailing the turbo smoothed mesh is hard.

    @monkey boy I will bring the seat angle back you are both right on that, just wasnt thinking. Good eye on the deep keel. After ww 2 russian aircraft started looking more german(wonder why lol) so I followed it through to my design.

    Ty for the comments guys.
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    Ok after much consideration I have started the mig over and this time NO TURBO SMOOTHING lol. so tell me what you think of this.
  • BerkutBerkut1 Posts: 0Member
    much much better, but I think all migs since like mig-21 had 2 engines, and if you consider its space worthiness even 4 engines wouldn't be that far fetched, although I'm not sure how it would look
  • star_creationsstar_creations0 Posts: 0Member
    Your work does look great...your on the road of being a wonderful 3D artist..keep it up, and I will have a update on the fighter on Monday.

    Oh, also since these fighters can travel through space and air, instead of giving the ships Wing Flaps, i think that we should give them Maneuvers Thrusters located in key locations that will give the pilot max control of the fighter when it comes to flying and landing.

    Also, one hint...a good way to make the edges smooth, first select the edge, and Chamfer it...not to much, just enough to give it that curve look.

    Hope that later's boss
  • kborakkborak1 Posts: 0Member
    @star I will practice eith the camfering. Ty for the compliment. Im Trying to learn more every time I sit down.

    @berkut ty man And Im going to go with a hyper accellerated Ion drive for the power on the ships in my verse. So it will be one engine, maybe with some sort of helper engines maybe small rockets of some sort.
  • star_creationsstar_creations0 Posts: 0Member
    NP Boss...

    Also, for the engines, it is good idea to give the jets, (since they can travel in space and air) Four different type of engines.

    such as the Traditional Jet engines, Aerospike Engines, Sub-Light engines and the Hyper I-On Drive. I got this idea of the multi engine from the X-302 from Stargate, since that fighter can also travel from space to air.

    Just an idea boss...
  • Monkey BoyMonkey Boy0 Posts: 0Member
    Looking good, but certainly seing some serious changes over time here, my only concern here, would be that the current design looks a little too like the french Rafale fighter.

    I think the wingtips are now far too sharp, do you intend to mount missile rails on the tips or keep this sharp tip, or maybe round them out a little?
    How about a RCS pod on each wing-tip - make it like a wing-tip fuel tank, but much smaller, and flattened - perhaps you could also put split top and bottom airbrakes on the rear end of these pods, then they could not only act as air brakes, but could act differentially like the control surfaces on a B2 bomber to provide pitch and roll as well, to supplement the RCS thrusters.
    Vectored thrust would also provide some degree of pitch and yaw, but you would need two engines to use vectoring for roll.
    I have to say that I am always a fan of the redundency that at least two engines provides - damage to one, still get out of trouble.

    Those twin holes underneath about midway, are they intakes or reverse thrusters?
    If they are reverse thrusters, perhaps they could also be vectored downwards for some degree of vertical landing?

    The flarings on the nose, are they sensors, weapon ports or are they the reverse thrusters?

    @Berkut: just to be a trainspotter, the Mig-23 flogger and the Mig-27 (basically the same aircraft but for ground attack rather than air-to-air) both had one single large engine. And besides, the number of engines should not really be considered a step in design evolution, after all, the F-16 has one, and the up-comming joint strike fighter (f-35) will have one, and it will be same generation as the F-22 (but let's not get into argument over which one is best!)
  • BerkutBerkut1 Posts: 0Member
    heh, got me there, forgot about the Mig-23, well basically all modern migs have 2. I never said that its a step up in design evolution, I just said mig design bureau seems to prefer that arrangement. On top of that every time I think single engine I keep remembering something I watched on discovery channel recently about CF training aircraft, where the instructor says "This isn't an F-18, where if something goes wrong with an engine, you can still land the aircraft with one, on this if something goes wrong with the engine I have 3 words for you EJECT EJECT EJECT" lol. It does look a bit like rafale, but also like Mig 1.44. Gotta agree on the wingtips though, on a second look they seem very sharp. Another idea would be to have manuvering thrusters at the wing tips.
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