Greetings!

Welcome to Scifi-Meshes.com! Click one of these buttons to join in on the fun.

Greetings!
This is the fancy new sidebar. It offers quick access to your profile, messages, threads and so on.
Hit the X in the top right corner to dismiss this message.
Greetings!

Welcome to the fancy new Scifi-Meshes.com! You old username and password should work. If not, get in touch with staff either here, on Facebook or on Discord.

For a quick summary on what's new, check out this thread.
You should also check out the Community Guidelines here.
You can check out most recent posts here or by clicking the handy links on the top menu or the sidebar.

You can dismiss this message by clicking the little X in the top right corner.

U.S.S. Coronado, Katana Class Starship

1246

Posts

  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #92
    If you don't want an answer, don't ask the question. :p
    Go back and look; I didn't actually ask a question. ;)
    Like I said, this kind of stuff happens in CGI. I get weird things like this from time to time, and I don't know why. It doesn't seem to matter which 3D software you're using, it happens in a lot of them. (I stopped short of saying "all of them" because I can't say that for certain. ;)) I've been saying for years that lights are one area where CGI is still behind and this is a great example of why.
    I do know why, actually. It has to do with the mathematical modeling going on and simplifications vs. the crazy photon interactions going on in the real world.

    Without an artist making a deliberate effort to muck up a surface, the mathematical model for Phong shading (and approximations related thereto) provides an accurate representation of what a perfectly smooth surface would do when a single ray of light hits it. Of course, the notion of a "perfectly smooth surface" or a "single ray of light" are both completely nonsensical in the real world, so it always looks wrong.

    Bump/normal mapping helps, diffuse and spec maps with subtle mottling to the color (even some low-level noise) help, etc. Better shading models help, too. Phong is really simple; something like Oren-Nayar is a lot smarter and most CG packages are moving in that direction, but it's still an approximation. When there's no other surface detail (as in the case with most of these renders so far, since they're devoid of textures), it's just that much worse.
    Vortex5972 wrote: »
    That room needs more doors. :p
    Haha, yeah, it's not a terribly realistic room. Given how tall and narrow the windows are, though, you never really see more than a sliver of any room at a given time. It's also plausible that this space is actually two rooms. Since you'll (probably) never see the wall that divides them, though, it's simpler to just make one box for it.
    Thanks for the look in, interesting to see such things. I was wondering whether you'd used thicken on the glass. Two panes seems to do the trick nicely.
    A thickened object is more or less the same thing as two planes where refraction is concerned. Light's going to change velocity twice: once when entering the new medium and once when exiting. In CG, the refraction is going to react to the surface normal, so it'll hit two surface normals regardless of whether or not they're a single enclosed object or two planes.

    Jester (see first post) mentioned that he was curious what Coro would look like with a color scheme like the Vesta class, with striking contrasts between light and dark hull areas, as well as a stronger sense of color than you usually get with a Starfleet ship. Since I had already planned to use the light/dark contrast found on the Sovereign class and her peers, this fit right in, so we spent some time going back and forth on what looked good and finally settled on this as a general direction to go in.

    coro_2014-08-19-2235.jpg

    It goes without saying that the modules are all fully UVed now. :D This is purely a color map right now; no detail in it, no special spec mapping, no bump.
    Post edited by McC on
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    The color looks good.
    McC wrote: »
    Go back and look; I didn't actually ask a question. ;)

    No, but you did say you were perplexed by it. So, you were questioning it without actually asking a question. :p
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #94
    Haven't has as much time to work on her lately as I'd like, but I finally finished putting in the remaining panels, windows, and rooms on the dorsal saucer surface.

    coro_2014-08-29-0002.jpg

    I also added some more to the texture for these static pseudo-modules and have been maintaining the UVs as I go now, which makes everything slower, but means I can get color on the mesh sooner. Of course, I forgot to put in the dark gray lines on the light gray hull surface, so that part looks super-bland right now. :rolleyes:

    Now I need to swing around and do the ventral surface there. :argh:
    Post edited by McC on
  • jay-mojay-mo0 Posts: 0Member
    You are really turning my opinion around on the design of this ship. Looking really great. Looking forward to secondary hull details.
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #96
    Thanks, jay-mo!

    Got the ventral surface done between last night/this afternoon.

    coro_2014-08-30-1425.jpg

    Time to move onto the bridge!
    Post edited by McC on
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #97
    Here, have a bridge!

    coro_2014-09-07-2102.jpg coro_2014-09-07-2108.jpg

    I don't think I'm ready to call the bridge done yet, but it's at least fleshed-out enough to be worth looking at. :D
    Post edited by McC on
  • Vortex5972Vortex597267 Posts: 994Member
    WOO!! Now we can cross to the other side of the ship.

    Awesome stuff, as usual.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    Looking great as usual. I like the Voyager-style bridge.
    Vortex5972 wrote: »
    WOO!! Now we can cross to the other side of the ship.

    When I was a kid first watching TNG on TV, I thought that was what the bridge was. :shiner: When Picard said they needed to get to the bridge, I just thought it was necessary to access another part of the ship. Only later did I find out that bridge is another name for command center.
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #100
    Thanks, Vortex5972 and evil_genius_180!

    These took way longer than they had any right to. (Starting to play STO again didn't help with that... ;))

    coro_2015-01-29-0900.jpg coro_2015-01-29-0931.jpg


    All the "cape" texturework is just stand-in for tone. Those big dark swaths will have lots of little panel detail on them going forward and I'll probably futz with the baffles (or whatever they are) on the impulse engines, too. Mostly, I'm just super ready to move on from this section right now. :argh:
    Post edited by McC on
  • Vortex5972Vortex597267 Posts: 994Member
    Whoa! This things alive. :p

    Really liking the look of those engines. Nice looking colours and glows.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    Dude, awesome work on the impulse engines. They look fantastic. :thumb:

    Playing STO is a bad habit and will definitely cut into your modeling time. ;)
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #103
    Thanks, Vortex5972 and evil_genius_180!

    Ugh, I can't even tell what's a mesh error and what's just distorted UVs displaying unintended parts of the texture anymore. S'fine, I'll fix it later. :shiner: I definitely need to increase the subdivisions along the main arch of the spine there, too; you can see the segmentation in the shadow it casts.

    coro_2015-02-18-1437.jpg

    Originally, I was planning to have the Spectre landing pads rise up from inside the bay to provide the landing platform, with a separate hatch that closed when the platform lowered back down, but after thinking about it, I think the landing platform is going to lower down onto the catapult (not yet modeled) to deposit a returned Spectre, then raise back up once it's off-loaded. In other words, "up" is the default position for the landing pad, rather than "down."

    I'm actually getting pretty close to having modeled all of the detail I planned out in my initial paint-over, which means it'll soon be time for a new paint-over to plan out more detail! Of course, I guess "pretty close" is a relative term.
    Post edited by McC on
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    The landing area is looking great. :thumb:
    McC wrote: »
    Ugh, I can't even tell what's a mesh error and what's just distorted UVs displaying unintended parts of the texture anymore.

    That's one reason I wait to texture until I'm done. ;)
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #105
    Thanks, evil_genius_180!

    Just about done with all the modeled detail from my paintover. Now I either UV and do stub-in textures for everything so far, the way I did for the saucer and modules, or I do a new paintover to figure out wtf I do next...

    coro_2015-03-01-1825.jpg
    Post edited by McC on
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    Looking spiffy. :)
  • xumucanexumucane0 Posts: 0Member
    Holy crap that looks good. I never liked the ratio of saucer to star-drive in that Tech Manual drawing of this design, but with your execution, I', really coming around. That thing is looking great!
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #108
    Thanks, evil_genius_180 and xumucane!

    This took entirely too long (off-axis modeling is hard! wah!) and is entirely too detailed for how tiny a feature it is, but finally dragged the forward torpedo tubes kicking and screaming to a point where I'm happy with them.

    coro_2015-03-22-2159.jpg coro_2015-03-22-2145.jpg

    Also, first shot showing the panel layout for the engineering hull and the under-side saucer "LORASON" sensor array, inspired by the Nebula-class sensor pods.
    Post edited by McC on
  • TALON_UKTALON_UK0 Posts: 0Member
    Interesting underside to this thing, loving those torpedo ports too, so it was worth the pain.

    :D


    So are those bands of light on the front of the engineering hull some new form of navigational deflector, or this new sensor array you mention?
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    TALON_UK wrote: »
    Interesting underside to this thing, loving those torpedo ports too, so it was worth the pain.

    :D
    Thanks, TALON_UK!
    So are those bands of light on the front of the engineering hull some new form of navigational deflector, or this new sensor array you mention?
    Coro and her Katana class sisters were, in the fictional narrative of the game, the first ships purpose-built by Starfleet to use quantum slipstream tech brought back by Voyager from the Delta Quadrant. So, what you're seeing there is the main deflector, styled like that seen on Arturis's Dauntless, the only other ship in canon to be purpose-built with slipstream propulsion.

    The sensor array is inset into the flat part disc on the ventral saucer surface, with the lines running along the ship's flight axis. This shot of the underside of a Nebula class sensor pod should shed light on things, as well as hint at the general appearance this will have once it's textured.
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    Yeah, the Dauntless is what came to mind when I saw the deflector. I like it. The torpedo launchers look great, as does the bottom of the secondary hull.
  • AresiusAresius337 Posts: 4,124Member
    The similarity to the Insignia-class becomes more and more noticeable....
  • Vortex5972Vortex597267 Posts: 994Member
    Great stuff. Loving the detail on the torp launchers. Never been a fan of those kinds of deflectors myself, but looks cool at any rate.
  • YggYgg0 Posts: 0Member
    love the details too, especially the torpedo launcher, i made a similar deflector dish on one of my ships, nice work

    could we get some more perspective shots please
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #115
    Thanks, evil_genius_180, Vortex5972, and Ygg!
    Aresius wrote: »
    The similarity to the Insignia-class becomes more and more noticeable....
    If I'm about to completely misinterpret your comment, then I apologize.

    I know Mark's Insignia is iconic to a lot of folks (hell, his pre-Insignia version, which I link in the first post, was iconic to me!), but I'm not sure what comments like this are intended to mean. From my POV, ever since I made my very first take on this design back in '99, people have been asking if it's Mark's. That's a very frustrating refrain to hear on repeat for 16 years, even if it's meant in a complimentary way, when the "truth" is that it's Sternbach's design that Mark and I each put our own spin on.

    When the two designs are inspired by the same source and set in the same "era", they're inevitably going to look similar. Personally, I think they diverge more and more as the process goes on. Their secondary hulls, for example, are nothing alike.

    Between my comment here and my (lengthy) write-up of the real-world design history this has gone through in the first post, this is going to be my last remark on this particular subject. Mark's Insignia is a great model. It is, to my eye, quite a different take on Sternbach's design than what I'm doing here. After over a decade and a half of being compared, I'm tired of having to explain it.
    Ygg wrote: »
    could we get some more perspective shots please
    All of the shots are perspective shots. :D That said, what sort of angles are you interested in? I keep each camera angle that I render from (i.e. for every shot you see throughout this thread, there's still a camera in my scene file I can hop right back to) and it's a trivial matter to make more. During the WIP process, I generally only pick new angles as-needed to show the most recent work, saving the full-ship renders for when the model's complete. This is mostly motivated by not wanting to wait 20-40 minutes for each shot to render if it's not showing anything really new. :D

    Speaking of anything really new:
    coro_2015-03-31-0905.jpg coro_2015-03-31-0934.jpg
    Post edited by McC on
  • AresiusAresius337 Posts: 4,124Member
    Please don't mistake my comments as something bad. While many might think that pointing to a likeness in appearance is bad (plagiarism as out-of-verse insult, too similar design to be a different class as in-verse point), I mean it in the terms of It looks similar to an epic design, and thus itself is also epic. ;)
  • TeddyDaddyTeddyDaddy0 Posts: 0Member
    Is is an awesome deflector material! slightly reminds me of the Dauntless from Hope and Fear :) And of corse, you are inspired by that too, as I see from the newer posts. Can I have a question which in probably many people are interested: how did you manage to make this materials ? :) Keep going!
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    And there I go with another 3+ month drought. Sorry about that... I wish I could say I've not been idle on this, but the truth is I kinda have. However, I started working again last night and finally finished a feature that has been giving me a particularly hard time! More on that in a moment.
    Aresius wrote: »
    Please don't mistake my comments as something bad. While many might think that pointing to a likeness in appearance is bad (plagiarism as out-of-verse insult, too similar design to be a different class as in-verse point), I mean it in the terms of It looks similar to an epic design, and thus itself is also epic. ;)
    Ahh, okay. I'm sorry to have taken in the wrong way, then. I'm a bit sensitive where this ship's design is concerned, due to the very long history I have with it. :)
    TeddyDaddy wrote: »
    Can I have a question which in probably many people are interested: how did you manage to make this materials ? :) Keep going!
    The deflector material is actually really simple, to the point where it's almost cheating. Here's a screenshot of the node setup (click to enlarge):

    deflector_nodes.jpg

    Basically, it's two overlapping Checker Textures, using the hull's bounding box coordinates as their input and then manipulated with Mapping nodes so that they stack to make the lines. The dark part is a simple bronze diffuse + white beckmann glossy addition and the blue part is alternating colors of blue feeding into an emission shader.

    So! Coro always had the ability to land, since she's not a huge ship and drew a lot of inspiration from the capabilities exhibited by Voyager. There's a particularly epic moment from the old sim where she lands on planet in a distant galaxy (we fell through a wormhole at one point, y'see, and got stuck) that I've long intended to animate. After a lot of fighting with mesh errors and rebuilding geometry and so on, I finally managed to create the landing struts and the bay doors. Then I had to figure out how to animate the damn things, which involved learning about Blender's Drivers feature (very similar to Maya's). This entire animation is controlled by just three custom attributes on the "Hull" mesh (Doors Open, Gear Extended, Gear Angled), which are used to drive other objects' properties. The doors themselves are animated via Shape Keys rather than transforms and they are absolutely and totally a cheat that I plan to further disguise with texturing. Anyway, here's a quick OpenGL viewport render of them animating:

    Yes, the landing feet do clear the bay doors. Just barely. :p Obviously, these feet alone wouldn't support the ship's weight or even weight distribution; I'm planning to integrate rear legs into the warp pylons. The saucer, like Voyager's will have to be held aloft by SIF and low-level tractor beam repulsion or some such.

    Onward!
  • Vortex5972Vortex597267 Posts: 994Member
    Ooo looking really cool. Setting up rigging for moving parts is something I may well have to look into soon.

    Nice to see you back. Now get cracking with some work. :p
  • evil_genius_180evil_genius_180647 Posts: 8,449Member
    That's really cool. It's great to see that you're back to work on this. :)
  • McCMcC196 Posts: 659Member
    edited June 18 #121
    Thanks, Vortex5972 and evil_genius_180!

    Ugh, this was tedious, but hey: stardrive hull paneling (at least dorsal and lateral surfaces) all done!

    coro_2015-07-26-2216.jpg

    Needs some windows and it'll get the same multi-tone treatment as the saucer for sure. Possibly other various dodads. But the panels are always a big hurdle, so it's nice to have them done.
    Post edited by McC on
Sign In or Register to comment.