Model's disappearing after ProBoolean.Scene inside, max2011.

Enterprais

Hi, I'm trying to make the new tron light disc model. I already made the loft disc form and then I've got this problem - I did the decorative lines in Autocad, imported them as spline, and tried to make a deepening. Please, help me with it.

Chris2005

I'm not sure booleaning works with splines, only solid geometry... if your spline is more or less a cookie cutter, in that it has 2 edges, and inside and outside, extruding the spline shape, will give the spline design some bulk, to which you could cut into the other geometry, also, make sure you have selected the right method, for the boolean, if I gather correctly, you want to cut a pattern into another object... if that's case, make sure the cutting method, is set to subtraction, or you could also, do subtraction + imprint, then select the polys and extrude them negatively, to create a deepening... if I understand what you're trying to do correctly.

However, from what I've heard from many other users, is to avoid booleaning if possible.

L2K

havent open your file. but from what ive read from mister chris, youre trying to cut out an object with a spline.
that doesnt work with the boolean operator.
you need another function, called shape merge.
and its extremely dirty too.

my advice would be not to use it.
you can make a clean section of the disc, say 5A°, cut it by hand and keeping it clean, then multiply it 72 times

Chris2005

I just opened it, and it's a spline geometry...



I just tried Pro Boolean as well, and it causes the gray object to disappear...

I then tried, regular boolean, with it set to Cut and Refine, then converted the geometry to a editable mesh, which allows you to select the booleaned area, and I assume you want to make these lines inset..., so I set a negative value of 0.5.





The cutting is not perfect, but booleaning unless you have super high poly models, produce geometry errors.

Enterprais

This was spline, I did "convert to editable mesh" to it, isn't this mean that it isn't a spline anymore? Discovering tis problem myself, I found out that if I'll do the shell operation to the disc before boolean, and then boolean-it'll work, the grid will be ugly, but that's another question. I suppose, that the problem solved, but I don't know.. Professionals will never do such things to make this simple disc..

Chris2005

Enterprais wrote: »

This was spline, I did "convert to editable mesh" to it, isn't this mean that it isn't a spline anymore? Discovering tis problem myself, I found out that if I'll do the shell operation to the disc before boolean, and then boolean-it'll work, the grid will be ugly, but that's another question. I suppose, that the problem solved, but I don't know.. Professionals will never do such things to make this simple disc..

Well, it's not a spline anymore once you convert it to it's own mesh, but if you made the spline in Max, you could have increased the interpolation of the spline, not sure if Autocad has something similar for it's splines, but in max, it would make the curves smoother, so when it was converted to an editable mesh, it would have more geometry work with, when booleaning.

You can also, create a high resolution black and white image of the design, you wish to imprint, select the faces you wish to alter, and detach them from the main mesh, and then add a displacement modifier, and use the high res image, as the basis for the geometry... however, the quality would depend on poly count, so you might have to increase the poly count of the geometry by remodeling it, if you used lathe, just increase the segments, etc. before you convert it to a mesh, and also, the resolution of the image map being used, will play a factor in the quality...

Hmmmm, so far, the best result I've gotten is just using the regular boolean modifier, on the object... the shell modifier then boolean method has given the geometry some poly errors...

MadKoiFish

I would avoid editable mesh but use editable poly. Mesh removes a lot of the editing controls. Keep in mind these operations will collapse the stack in max so you cannot return to the spline cage etc. Boolean will not work better with higher polys either, it creates a mess no matter what.

What I would do is use that imported spline as a template and manually cut those lines and extrude them. When you do those concentric lines make sure it is not on top of existing geometry. As this will create a faceted look. There is a tut here regarding this issue on trek saucers or round surfaces.

With boolean operations you will have to understand you will have to go in manually and correct any doubled verts or orphaned verts or when you go to extrude it'll make a mess even worse. You will also have to keep an eye out for close edges and tight tris as these will make for strange wrinkles.

Personally I only use cut booleans, no subtractions additions etc. With cuts or stencils as some call them it is easier to control the mess you will have to clean up. If your on max9+ you should have access to "pro boolean" If it is available use it over the regular boolean. Better math and less mess.

Chris2005

MadKoiFish wrote: »

Boolean will not work better with higher polys either, it creates a mess no matter what.

ah, ok, I was drawing on my experience, that higher poly counts have yielded better cutting... but yea, it still usually results in awful geometry patterns.

MadKoiFish wrote: »

If your on max9+ you should have access to "pro boolean" If it is available use it over the regular boolean. Better math and less mess.

That's what I believe he's been trying to use, but it makes the disc/ring mesh vanish... my success came with regular booleaning... but it's still not a perfect cut, in some spots.

MadKoiFish

http://www.scifi-meshes.com/forums/content.php?134-3ds-Max-Tutorial-Cutting-on-Complex-Surfaces-Part-1
this tut should define some of what I was talking about. I have not found the other one yet but it is here on SFM. I think it was malek who wrote it. (dont hold me to that hahah )

Disappearing mesh is often a open face somewhere or stray/orphaned verts. Before boolean you need to collapse the stack, anything else is asking for a script error and resulting core dump. It is late so I do not have the time to eyeball the file. if I have time tomorrow I will take a look and see if I can clarify things. No guarantees though.

woah where did L2K's post come from. O_o ever since that forum update I swear!

Chris2005

MadKoiFish wrote: »

http://www.scifi-meshes.com/forums/content.php?134-3ds-Max-Tutorial-Cutting-on-Complex-Surfaces-Part-1
this tut should define some of what I was talking about. I have not found the other one yet but it is here on SFM. I think it was malek who wrote it. (dont hold me to that hahah )

I might watch that 2 part video, might help me improve my mesh cutting, etc, I never saw the links to the videos, just the text directions, and I personally can follow along with a hands on video type tutorial, than reading step by step.

Melak

MadKoiFish wrote: »

When you do those concentric lines make sure it is not on top of existing geometry. As this will create a faceted look. There is a tut here regarding this issue on trek saucers or round surfaces.

This one?

Enterprais

Thanks to everyone, figured the problem out. ProBoolean correctly making the deepening after adding to the disc "Shell" modifier. Here are test renders and the model itself.

Here are some results.