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3D-= MKF random trek thread =-



  • markmasseymarkmassey365 StaffordshirePosts: 466Member
    ahh see i am an animator which is probably why my mind went there :)

    but it was by no means a demand man..... or even a request...

    Yea a helix frame would look good close up.. but probably unnecessary.. it looks detailed enough... for something that only you know is there :)
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Tossed some stuff int he shuttle ops room. Really tight in there and probably not a proper solution to the space and need. I should look at sinking it into the bay opening so there is a set of windows in the underside.

    Spent most of the time setting up interior lights for the open bays to be dimmer as I do a light render for comp. That and for some reason the way vray deals with the glow materials bays for some reason over light vs smaller rooms. Adjusting the glow objects does not seem to control this and atm rooms are super dim and bays are overly lit. SO, solution for now is to separate out the lights as unique materials and adjust them there.


    oops I see some missed smoothing around the panel. And bah I did not save the shuttle bay& cargo by renders.

    Also having issues with the glass IQR, having to resort to setting it near 1 but still getting that "solid" glass distortion going on even with a physical object for the glass vs just single faces set to render 2 sided.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Really fighting these light gizmos, lack of settings or controls rather and it is like being back in 2006 again as what is displayed in viewport has nothing to do with what you get. So, it is back to the old adjust render adjust render that I hate.
    Also seems I lost my lower cargo bay doors. I know I had toyed with leaving those open permanently but I had kept the doors. . . so somewhere likely during conversion they got eliminated as I cleaned out "junk" layers and objects.

    Unsure about the right of way lights. Might have to tone them down or just not set up gizmos for them.
    ashleytingerLizzy777Warp Propulsion LaboratoryRekkertBolianAdmiralFreakpubliusrMcCLoopholeJES
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • seanrseanr589 Brooklyn, NYPosts: 426Member
    right of way lights
    ? No idea which ones you mean. ;)

    Love the lighting and the additional, normally hidden stuff. You either need to get into animation or find someone to help out with that now that you went and built all that amazing detail! LOL
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    edited September 25 #2076
    Right of way lights are referring to the red & green lights that denote which way a ship is pointed. More naval things though I think the term is used with aircraft as well.

    You can kind of see I started out at the back and worked forward as the lights are a little better on the saucer. The one thing though is the color temp even though set varies on the light size. I think the worst part is selecting the gizmos. It is like they are secondary elements and everything else will select before you can select the gizmo. So I am having to freeze the mesh and unfreeze the mesh to rig it. Though I guess I could go into layer properties of the entire ship and deselect "frozen in grey" Really wish I could return to using the viewport for rigging and seeing via render lighting vs max default lights. (the latter really suck for modeling)

    Some renders with the hdri on. I think some fine tuning is needed and I gotta see if I can create some sort of fall off on the distance of some lights. Namely the inner struts and lower cargo bays.

    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Decided that maybe I should have the cargo pods in a housing vs just intersecting the bulkhead.
    I really got to do something about the cargo floor material.

    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • Wishbone_AshWishbone_Ash267 Posts: 243Member
    MadKoiFish wrote: »
    Decided that maybe I should have the cargo pods in a housing vs just intersecting the bulkhead.
    I really got to do something about the cargo floor material.

    so why don't you do something about it?
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    edited September 27 #2079
    Too busy/lazy to hunt around for a proper texture or other solution is why.
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Tossed in a quick obs room into the boxed in area and tossed in some screens and consoles. Might later on replace it with built in stuff exp in the rooms but I dunno how much of this will be used later on.
    Not sure if the marque should be the ships name uss or just have the UFP text.

    guess I could put windows in the hall ways leading to the control booth.
    glass test, spent a long time messing with this, still not happy with it as it is very slow and even with settings maxed, content behind is still muddy and fuzzy. Also finding the grain on early render is really heavy vs it being more macro blocky like. I have not altered render settings so I dunno. (maybe cats and single key hotkey crap again??) Also seeing a lot more of that crappy jpg compression vomit in the renders. Even with denoiser(vray one as I cannot get the nvidia one to activate).
    this is mostly a test run as I thinned out the flat glass and blurred off the reflections more than they appear here. (just a touch like 0.2units. )
    Gonna need to change out the material in the lights of the control room and adjust the fixtures as they are too bright right now.
    Lizzy777GestaltrojrensrspicerWarp Propulsion LaboratoryLoopholeFreakBolianAdmiralBrandenbergJayruand 1 other.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • seanrseanr589 Brooklyn, NYPosts: 426Member
    Are you actually rendering out to JPG? I _never_ use JPG anymore, only PNG. JPG compression is just shitty as well even on very high quality settings. IMO, your glass looks fantastic, BTW.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    edited September 29 #2082
    No, it is the renderer that creates a jpg artifact like vomit. Zoom in on the samples and you'll see it it is not due to the conversion from my lossless renders as I use PSP7 for jpg so none of that macro block vomit like what PS or other stuff puts out with the oversharp contrast "enhancement"

    Take a look at the middle picture look at the saucer as that is a location it is bad. Also around the container frames.
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Mess of small things chamfers etc. Redid the ceiling lights and added a mess of decal like things and replaced the ship name again.

    Also render settings are all whack now as I found a quick set up menu thing and it messed with the set up I had. So for now there is more "grain" but not so much of that muddy smeary jpg shit. Drawback, times are up some and it is bucket rendering and the bucket is I am guessing variable depending on what is being rendered. The shuttle bay though yuck. SLOW. . .

    Mulling over what to do with those angled flat sides near the ceiling of the landing bay area of the cargo bay. Also planning to do something with the lights in the "parking" area of the inner bay and set up the ceiling of that area to match the hangar.

    25min exterior:
    43min for this:
    reason I do not do animations.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Quick pass of the interior cargo area with gizmo lights in the fixtures of the ceiling. I loose some of the neat shadows but would probably loose that anyhow with lum materials behind the translucent plastic diffuser. Need to mess with color temp of course but I am figuring I will have to re-balance everything in the end anyhow. Might have to switch everything over to color vs temperature values as they still seem to vary depending on surface area or gizmo size.

    gotta figure out the noise levels so that the denoiser isn't smoothing out so much. Still not getting the nvida one to work. Could be because I had a AMD card in here early on then moved over to the 1660. Hate to think I will have to reinstall max or vray but that might be the solution.
    Also visible in the last render is a example of what the glass does that I am not happy about the window jambs appear only 2 or 3" thick when they are three times that thickness.

    Ok render is done and well, the gizmos as visible do not blur off very well compared to the materials lights. But for now as they can barely be seen I think I will stick with them even though they do not seem to speed up rendering times. I also think part of the jpg looking mush is partly coming from the denoiser. As this is running a bucket vs progressive over the entire scene I can see the pre-denoiser scene and grain city. It is mostly a problem with the internal parts of the ship, and some of the darker areas. Well, stands out most. So I have to see if I can set things up so it pays more attention to those areas, or if that is even possible.

    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • rojrenrojren594 Louisville, Kentucky USAPosts: 1,590Member
    The speckled one reminds me of watching the UHF channels when I was a kid.
  • JESJES21 Posts: 52Member
    Every time that I look at one of your designs, I am blown away by the amount of detail that you put in. I think that the Balmung is just a perfect TLE design, how she combines design elements from the Ambassador and Excelsior class, and I can't help but think that perhaps many of the starships built from around TLE before the Galaxy class used similar components.

    There is this design that I doodled on paper a while back that uses similar hull components, but of uses a configuration similar to the Kearsarge class from Starfleet Battles, and would be to the Balmung what the Miranda class is to the Constitution.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    OOps missed posting these from last week. Messed with some stuff and added in some panels over that flat area I complained about earlier. Also broke things up to eliminate that huge flat walls look. I might need to adjust the ceiling light panels and other lighting.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Mocking up a rough space suit for light duty or off flavor planets. Idea is to not be too detailed atm it is subdived a lot but I might drop it a few iterations. Renders are far closer than I ever plan do get to the thing. Working on it based on a 6ft human.

    Giving some nods to the chest plat from TMP as well as the helmets from STD as I want them to have a pretty clear view, though I suppose by this time frame they probably have some sort of articulated neck fabric so the helmets do not need to be modern space goldfish bowls. But hey TMP they were fixed and I think even in TNG they were as well.
    The upper harness/suit I might break up into straps instead as I want some sort of tool system on the waist and hips. Also planning to try using bump or displacement to add fake wrinkles all over it so it does not look like a inflated wetsuit. Also have all the patterning to align and do later on.

    Also I loath organics! lol. and yeah I know I could use some sort of sculpting software but eh.

    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • lewisnivenlewisniven1446 UKPosts: 308Member
    Looks great so far, I've never tried anything organic like that, look forward to seeing what you come up with. Have you parked the Galaxy model for now?
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    edited October 10 #2090
    yeah the galaxy is on hold possibly pending a commission and me taking a break. Does not help been wasting life with genshin impact.
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Just a bit of messing around and adjusting things. Decided to go with a bendable neck vs fish bowl.The idea is the helmet will either detach around the glass and the upper area above the band or along the silver bit leaving the neck collar in place.

    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Blocking in the harness stuff. Might just model it into the suit, same for the upper and lower parts so when it is rigged it will all bend without much overlaps.
    Also tempted to go with hazzard orange vs the gray to match some canon scenes.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Some more refinements and the typical lights in to cause tonnes of annoying reflections for the person in the suit.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Shoes I tried to base off the TMP engineering suits that were later use din TUC. Does not translate too well so Might just make em big rubber boots under the pant overhang.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Probably should get on the discord or whatever to ask this.

    Vray users on max is there a way to do the glare bloom and denoise on a already rendered image? For some damned reason it randomly decides not to include these in the various channels and sadly after a 24+hr render and the 5th go at this it failed to produce a denoise channel. I want to manually blend it into the final render as anything behind glass is turned to mush. I also wanted to have the bloom/glare as a separate channel so I could eliminate some lights from the process or to use the "self ilum" channel as the one that is used to calculate the lens effects.

    ATM, well prior to me moving on I tried to apply or turn on the bloom/glare filter to get my channel pass of it on the final render and it just did nothing. (typical of this it just randomly works or does not work. if it does not work it means having to re-render and hope that it does. . . . . . . .

    Anyhow so far I have not seen anything online just keeps regurgitating articles on how to use or random junk.

    Finding a lot of my post passes are not so possible in vray. Granted I probably do not need some of them but is it really nice to get a diffuse gloss/spec and other passes in one go vs having to render them out manually. Though the AO pass still needs to be done as I could not take the 81hour proposed time to render this scene with the built in AO setting for the RGB color channel.

    Still not happy with the output as there is a load of grain and denoiser is dodgy as fuk, not working randomly or making a mess of detail and having various settings grayed out. And to add to that tuts or help files pointing at some other "version"
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    edited November 24 #2096
    Ok nearly a month. Lots of changes moved to a 4k 32" screen overhauled my work station and divorced the 2d side of things to the "server" system. Mostly cause the cintiq is just too damned big for the new screen and it on the table.

    Anyhow SOTL is done, well been done. I took a few weeks off to waste life on Genshin.

    Plan is to get back to things with a possible commission if things work out and the long slog of converting some of my old projects. I have decided to halt current projects to do this as during and after the SOTL stuff I really wanted to compose images and just couldn't as the only ships in vray were the Balmung the D and the Jigoku class.

    Idea is to start with my TOS connie as it should be a easier conversion as most of it is a default material and large texturemaps. I have considered redoing them or improving them. I had also mentioned at one time that I wanted to do a less screen canon version. no re-imaginings or major changes just small things mostly in texture or just fine details. Stuff with enough grain or a blurry eye it would appear like how she looked on screen.

    Kinda funny the mental ray light gizmos still work in max viewports unlike the vray ones which leave me with a black ship. Anyhow she looks ok but everything outside of textures like bussard effects and lighting will have to be redone.

    anyhow not much really, as I just started setting things up for this and I dunno how quickly I will get into it. Also a show of my ui layout, all needs major overhaul as it just does not work that well on a 32" 4k display. Thinking of grouping everything to one side vs distributed all around. And no scaling isnt a fix as I am stuck with 125 150 and 200% and all make win10 look like 1080p as win10 is full of bloated gutters and overly large UI components. BLEAH. (ribbon and vray toolbars are on as I needed stuff in the prior and the latter cannot at all be customized into the default max UI stuff. No matter what I do the buttons wont do anything when moved out of the vray toolbar. T_T

    edit: might have to do a install wipe as max is getting terrible after stopping render it hangs like it is saving every time adjust stuff itll hang and It just puts me off doing anything. Worse than max 2013 on my old old pc not the 4770k but the crappy X58 system.
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Render of the ship with 3 vray gizmos and no HDRI. HDRI seems to dull the ships down a lot.

    ATM Only the saucer and bridge b/c deck area is in vray mats rest is mr.

    I might look into messing with the "metalness" slot. Probably have to tweak up a custom map for this. That or do more foolery with composite layers.

    ok, well the image has the gloss map set to the METALNESS slot, with a color correction and increase in contrast. Kinda works but still does not look all that great.


    Again only the saucer and upper decks are vray everything else is still MR. So loads of bounce spill from them etc. Also bypassing denoiser as it really turns everything to mud. Dunno my once subtle maps look super saturated and clipped.

    heh plain lights are super fast 1.8min per render. . . lol sure beats the 1hr ones of the balmung at this size.

    All the slowness and lag and hangs after doing anything really has me not wanting to touch this stuff anymore though. Might have to rip it all out and reinstall. stop a rende rit hangs, render ends it hangs, turn on a light or turn a light off it hangs (and no I do not have the VP displaying the lights all default lighting as vray gizmos do not work in viewport, well they do but are super dim to the point of not working.

    Here is one with the hdri on, and another with denoiser on, looks like mud and a mess of jpg artifacts.
    denoiser on, well the denoiser results channel.
    Warp Propulsion LaboratoryBolianAdmiralFreakStarshipLizzy777BrandenbergJESpubliusrwolfman
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    edited November 24 #2098
    Getting carried away fro a I'll sit down for a bit and render out some images. . . Started with realizing that I forgot the sensor trim thing as it was denoted as part of the saucer maps, then it went to oh might as well replace the internal materials and glow parts to fooling with the diffusion dome. Sadly no omre cheater glass I have to do all thickness glass vs single sided or just lumps. The dome acually was still a sphere object that was flattened on one side (max can flatten one side or "squash" so all the control edges move up the surface.) So anyhow sensor dome, most of the non lit guts are not v-ray mats yet. Need to figure out what they used to look like before I move to replacing the materials. Either way a bit less painful than I had expected.
    really need to sit down and properly calibrate my displays. These ultrawides it all looks ok saturation wise but the 32 it looks super green. . . (ugh) Boosted saturation. . . . . heh. It is all pretty much a whole new set up here as the smaller displays were on my server system, all the old monitors are gone or moved so no references anymore.

    OH forgot this is the hdri lighting. I am probably using the standard gizmos all wrong anyhow as I turned off decay. If it was on I would have to have the gizmo very large and the multiplier at 30+ (well it defaults at 30)

    gizmo lights. (vraylight)

    EDIT: upper dome and markers.
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • FreakFreak1038 Posts: 4,288Member
    She's a thing of beauty!
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    Oh boy I thought gee maybe I should go back to default icon size it might help as apparently I cannot float toolbars between the viewports and the "command panel" I can only shift them far left or right and if I do them top or bottom I cannot justify them to the right. Primary modeling windows often are there and well less room to go from icons to the command panel. . . . . 2560 was ok but 3840 nah.

    ANYHOW I found out I already was running the large icons. . . . pffft. Real issue isnt rez but the behavior of all LED backlit lcds I have seen the floating grid thing that causes that strange holo like look around the rim of the screen. I see it in tvs and all but the most expensive lcds EG 2k+ units. Most of those I think are using a full array or using a glass diffuser and are a good 3"+ thick and at 32" would weight in about 60lbs. heh. Some real first world issues I guess. probably wouldnt have bothered me when I was 25 but now PAH. I am starting to think 32" isn't large enough for this rez. >_< I cringe at people running this at 27" but then again they are probably wasting the pixels by scaling everything so it looks more like a 1080p screen. Yeah fonts look sharper but desktop is sacrificed. Some people just seem not to get that. Was worse in the CRT days where they cannot see that 1600X1200 meant so much more than 1024X768 or 600X400. -_- lol.
    On the screen these icons are like -1/4inch or more like 5mm >_< oops hah.

    Anyhow updates:
    Applied all the main hull materials. I think I need to make some changes and alterations due to articles I have seen since starting this build. Small things like panels not appearing inside some painted areas as well as some parts not being the colors I used. Also changes I was convinced of though evidence. Though some are not direct photo evidence as a lot of this is all we gots refs but we gots super secrets and wont show shit. -_- I have sorta corrected the larger monitor to better match my others. I do not have the color meter anymore and dunno if I will spend the wad on one again atm.

    Next step is getting all the other random bits that are not included in the textures. Some times I think I should have textured everything as a singluar map even bits I had stenciled. Can do this easily in uvw unwrap stage as making those areas be located elsewhere on the layout. Maybe something to consider in the future.

    So things to do:
    *do all interiors redo the window diffusion panels (give anything clear thickness or volume if it is a solid.
    *do interior rooms over
    *do new self ilum materials for interiors and other bits
    *do all misc materials still in MR
    *Then do all the corrections and additions I want to make then fine tune the hull surfacing. This includes altering the copper ring and changing out the back facing rings behind the deflector. I am still not convinced of the deflector spike so that will remain a alum finish. Changing the ribbed things behind the bussards, removing panels between hull markings on the saucer centerline. Possibly desaturating the "shellac" weathering. Possibly lightening some of the weathering in the rings. I have them tan but they really creep into a black shadow.

    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish3130 Right in the plumsPosts: 4,472Member
    eh for no real reason 4k.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
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