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3D-= MKF random trek thread =-

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  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1655 CaliforniaPosts: 1,937Member
    MadKoiFish wrote: »
    Some more adjustments to the cobra head. Found a shot if it at a oblique angle that shows it is steeper than what I had. Really wish there were some better images of this area.
    Definitely a troublesome area on this ship.

  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1655 CaliforniaPosts: 1,937Member
    edited July 2020 #1983
    On your two shots of the back with the saucer separation (8 posts above). I also noticed that the windows above the shuttle bay doors are wider in the saucer separation image than they are on the model shot below. The red paint is different too.
    Post edited by Brandenberg on
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    yup most of the saucer windows were narrowed up some you can see the masks were slightly narrower. Also consider the separation image is really post processed so some of the stuff is distorted some. Good example are the speckles on the ship in since shots where it looks like light leaks. I think this is just reflected highlights showing up as light as the windows were all done as a separate pass.

    but it is fairly clear the refitting of the model they tried to unify sizes of things.

    The red lines are not the only differences, loads of applied panels are added in the generations refit and removal oddly of some details like those 2 numbered hatches next to the smaller bay. (guessing smaller escape pods, or stacked up pods. I also suspect maybe the red decal was applied upside down. I will have to look at other shots of the original to see. But it is one more annoyance I will have to nail down along the way lol.

    I sorta cheated out today and spent most of it playing twilight princess and screaming at the dumb camera in that game.
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1655 CaliforniaPosts: 1,937Member
    Taken as a whole, it implies that if the physical model builders admit there are improvements that can be made to the model, then any idealized improvements we make on our meshes aren't completely unreasonable. However, I also recognize that some changes might just be that the model deteriorated or took damage while in storage and so what we see are merely quick fixes to get the job done, and not attempted improvements.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Well apparently the same people who worked on it prior did the "refit" so they applied some of the things they would have wanted or had wanted to do to it. And all the hindsight sort of thing. They also had to add stuff so it would "hold up" to the big screen.

    And yeah the ship was in a sorry state and a lot of stuff was broken such as the fluorescent bits inside. Heck during the show you could see marker lights and the like burning out.

    That article at memory alpha has coverage on that part of the models history. I think most of it came from the specials on Generations or one of the brd TNG sets.

    https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Galaxy_class_model
    scroll down past the color swatches and it has notations about the film refit. I think there is another article on this with interviews out there too. Forgotten trek (website) maybe?
    publiusr
    Each day we draw closer to the end.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Cut out at least the rim for the saucer receiver for the secondary hull. Not sure yet if I will clone off the cobra head then work in the negative spaces or just fudge it in by hand.

    galaxy-0515.jpg
    galaxy-0516.jpg

    Might have the fit too tight, wanted it clear it was a joint and not a panel. had made the neck part round up from the hull some but I have undone some of that as it hid the seam more than it made it appear as a joint. And yes I still need to work the spine thing and cut that into the saucer parts.
    Lizzy777RekkertashleytingerBrandenbergFreakZhor2395
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Well dinner and fooling with games again >_> So adjusted things more around the join. Also adjusted the spine part and altered the spine near the junction as there is a seam just before the lifeboats. One thing I noticed is a offset of the lifeboats from where I have them and the generations model. However checking the old paint job they are where I have them vs the Generations refit. Issue I have though is how the hell can a lifeboat be located here? the hull is only a few feet thick. Even if I shift this row up to match the generations version there is not enough room for a pod underneath.
    galaxy-0518.jpg
    ashleytingerFreakLizzy777
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  • ashleytingerashleytinger2001 Central OhioPosts: 1,233Member
    Emergency supply pods instead of actual lifepods?
    rojren
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    edited July 2020 #1990
    Eh, would think the hatches would then be appreciably different. There might be room for salvageable resources for the lifeboats if they were in the generations positions, likely why they moved them up as someone thought of the clearance. ATM if you account for say 6" of hull many areas those hatches are over would be solid. Either way I am replicating the model not re-engineering it but if I had my way those hatches would go. Actually I'd shift em down to the cobra head.

    Here is a quick half done render showing my objects even occlude into the cobra head elements. So there is just maybe at most 1~2ft of space to work with. Move them up where they are in generations and you get a lot more room. But still super tight to fit a standard pod. Either case the inboard ones would have to go no matter what. Another idea would be they pass through but there is no canon evidence of pass through chutes in these locations just imprints from the mold taken of the cobra head to match up the mating surfaces. (seen in the screen caps below) But still. For something back in the days of by hand and pencil and ink there are very few of these "issues" Seen modern stuff fail harder.
    galaxy-0522.jpg

    Anyhow knocked in the details under the union area. Left a bit of a gap for the lifeboats that are in this area. Now the fun of merging this into the saucer bits.
    galaxy-0519.jpg
    Sooo tempted to put some observation windows in here.
    galaxy-0520.jpg

    galaxy-0521.jpg

    Oh and forgot I cut the notch in for the spine. I might redo is once again (5th times a charm???) Though I vaguely see the spin does hitch some as it goes under. This is in a scene during link up in Farpoint. BUT this hitch in the spine is not there in the scene where they use the hero prop with the elevating locks. Looking at some of the sfx in those scenes and the obvious tape around the joining area that they applied a under hull and cobra head panel to the ship then removed them when the ship was reassembled. So some of the details I see in the approach shot are probably due to removable elements. . . . or adjustments made to allow it to clear the metal frame in the model.

    caps attached below.
    farpointapproach.jpg
    farpointjoin.jpg
    so far these are the best images I have of these parts short of the blown out christies photo and one shot of the ship leaning on a board sans the saucer.

    ah man up all night again waiting for renders >_>
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    RekkertBrandenbergLizzy777
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Joined up the undercut and cleaned up some bits.
    galaxy-0526.jpg
    LeoBerlinkadenashleytingerLizzy777RekkertscifiericBrandenberg
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  • count23count23361 Posts: 779Member
    FYI the reason you may be seeing some disparate parts between the close up and the distance shots of the models is the cobra head itself was a separate model for that one join/departure shot.

    ndqpt1j5h7ag.png

    It may explain the difference you saw between closed and open that appeared to have possibly been tape related.
    Formerly Nadesico.

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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    edited July 2020 #1993
    uh if you read what I wrote that is what I was referring to. In which I was speculating how much was different between the two and how this will reflect on making a 3d model of such elements.
    galaxy-cobrahead-stunt.jpg?w=300
    This is in a scene during link up in Farpoint. BUT this hitch in the spine is not there in the scene where they use the hero prop with the elevating locks. Looking at some of the sfx in those scenes and the obvious tape around the joining area that they applied a under hull and cobra head panel to the ship then removed them when the ship was reassembled. So some of the details I see in the approach shot are probably due to removable elements. . . . or adjustments made to allow it to clear the metal frame in the model.

    Adding the nose down saucer off image as I realized I never posted it when I referenced it.
    bj70lnc7x0ow.png?w=400
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Oh, the segmentation. Maybe I should have increased the edge count more. NOT that I will use this part of the ship at all. Am considering rotating the front or rear lifeboats as say if they all hinge on the red stripe end it night make more sense for these to have hinges inboard of each other. Dunno like I have said I doubt I will ever render this ship as separated parts. I do need the rough geo though.
    galaxy-0529.jpg
    galaxy-0530.jpg
    galaxy-0531.jpg

    Still not happy with the cobra head transition from the flat command deck to the nose curve. Some shots it appears to tighten up from the saucer edge, others it appears the spread out. Even in the render here the gloss aniso is doing odd visual things. Too many funny curves transitioning to other funny curves. GAH. And yes that will screw up my cutout somewhat if I mess with the head subdiv. sigh. . .

    I might respin the bridge blister part as it is just the dome and the green "floor" area.

    Next I guess are secondary window cutters, upper saucer windows, or work on the nacelle details. I should probably also look at wtf is going on with my gloss aniso as that seems to be doing odd things. Some point I will have to collapse the subdiv for the secondary then it will be loads of windows and grid cutting. YUCK.

    Lizzy777BrandenbergFreak
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Some full ship renders for overall and some extra stuff. I would want to do this differently but sticking to known work gives people something to relate to I suppose. Un applied material surfaces so those funky smoothing issues show on some parts.

    galaxy-0532.jpg
    galaxy-0533.jpg
    galaxy-0534.jpg
    galaxy-0535.jpg
    Lizzy777BrandenbergZhor2395LeoBerlinashleytingerWarp Propulsion LaboratoryFreakBolianAdmiral
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Some more details and stuff on the other stuff. Probably more than needed for the use it will serve. Also redoing the deflector elements to emit their own light vs having light objects floating around behind the elements. It does not light as well but allows me to compartmentalize all the parts.
    galaxy-0536.jpg
    galaxy-0537.jpg
    galaxy-0538.jpg
    And yeah those smoothing "chips" are still there. It is likely because the part is only 32segments in dai. Probably a setting somewhere to fix it.
    Warp Propulsion LaboratoryashleytingerBrandenberglewisnivenRekkertLizzy777FreakBolianAdmiral
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Ribbed. . . . . . .
    galaxy-0540.jpg
    dunno if I got them exactly right or the exact count.

    oh heh oops forgot to upload images and hit post. . . . .
    RekkertmdtaashleytingerLizzy777FreakBrandenberg
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Beginnings of the galactic washing machine.
    galaxy-0543.jpg
    never realized there is so little imagery of this part that isn't from the tv show itself.
    Lizzy777BrandenbergZhor2395
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    All the other bits slowly merging into the hatch area. Probably should just make it out of simple low poly bits but dunno carried away again. Bit hard doing this at scale as chamfers are really tight and auto weld keeps wanting to weld off all the chamfers. Software is suppose to graduate the percent amounts on things based on start state but it seems the lower end has very little granularity or I need to subdivide my units much further. EG thousands or millions of a inch or hundreds of a mm. Dunno.
    galaxy-0544.jpg
    galaxy-0545.jpg
    Still kinda fighting making a plexi white material to replicate the door and rim plastic on the original. Vray just seems to not want to replicate that milky white plexi. Have yet to decide if I want it off or lit. Either case atm if i do one or the other I will have to alter the material as I cannot replicate the lighting as I want to.

    Really in the end this thing will likely only be a dozen pixels high maybe more in the end. But hey I will have one for possible other uses down the road.

    Found all these cool lamp builds and a usb charger thing as warp cores heh I want one lol. Well a full length one almost all are too short.
    FreakLizzy777BrandenbergWarp Propulsion Laboratory
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Those out-feed fittings. I can only see them up to a point so I have no idea what they look like when they join up to the red tube bits. Also dunno how those disengage for ejection as those outfeeds in the pictures would not clear the railings and other stuff. I have drawings that show a coned fitting over these out feeds so dunno as the drawings I think are fan made. Then again I have not trolled the tng videos to find any possible angle that catches these parts. ATM I figure close enough. Personally Id set up something near flush to the core as the toppers on either end flare out to the dai of the intermix chamber. But whatever. (also unsure 60deg or 45deg. ATM it is set to 60. they are just cloned off objects so easy enough to shift about just have to remember to delete some of those pipes in the glowy ring area.
    galaxy-0547.jpg
    time to do the ribs stringers and the little pipes and those injector caps.
    Lizzy777BrandenbergFreak
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  • publiusrpubliusr550 Posts: 1,746Member
    Now the saucer did have an aft torpedo tube inside the cut-out, usable only after sep’

    A possible future project:

    Over at treknology.org in the early 24th Century history page, is something called the COUNCIL class by Jeff Robb.

    This is an Enterprise-C design not only closer to the ready room wall sculpture than Sternbach’s C, but even closer than Probert’s own.

    Instead of a phaser loop, the entire flush ring is a turret that can rotate. I would like to see dynamic shots of that in action.
  • ViperViper1679 Posts: 717Administrator
    Can you post reference of the material you are trying to replicate?
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Using these the most
    galaxy_warp_core_elevated_view.jpg
    05-galaxyschild-r.jpg
    true-q-hd-059.jpg
    warp_core_breach_close_up.jpg
    The lit up lights off and the one with Worf have been used the most with the gamma ramped up to eliminate the blacks and pull out detail. Also using the one with the Geordi and that pink girl(the half Q girl) for scale.

    rest off and on.
    tumblr_otwcnuaap41w8hpj6o1_1280.jpg
    engartic1.jpg
    yamato_warp_core.jpg
    galaxy_class_warp_core.jpg
    constitution_engineering.jpg


    these are fanon I think but they show some sort of detail on those injector areas. Also using the cutaway from the official Sternbach blueprints.
    injector.png
    galaxy-class-cruiser-sheet-9.jpg




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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    edited July 2020 #2004
    Trim ring? or whatever the first rings are. Next set differ, no idea how they change further up or down. Just gonna clone the style seen at the top of the worf and klingon image with the same ribbing count. 4 ribs then 8 every union until the top or bottom injector. Next I guess are the ribs. Wanna just make one and clone it but I do not see any usable seams in the original. I guess they molded them as a unit or the seams blend in. Still a large object to have molded as a single object. Cannot decide if I will do the fluro wire rig that you can see supporting the lighting through the ribs. Wont see it in my first use scenario but later on. . . . . . dunno. HAH.


    galaxy-0549.jpg
    galaxy-0550.jpg

    K.I.M. all materials are all temporary.
    Post edited by MadKoiFish on
    Lizzy777ashleytingerBrandenbergFreak
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  • ashleytingerashleytinger2001 Central OhioPosts: 1,233Member
    I guess the one thing you have to ask while you're modeling this is how much you're going to use it later on, and how close you're going to get with it.

    Or better yet, if you do decide to upgrade it later, how much of a pita do you want to make upgrading the model?
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    geh these diffuse bits sure chew up render time. Just quickly knocked together the rib bits. Those oval openings are what took up all the time since last post. I will look at replicating the "glitter"ish finish on the ribs. Not sure if it was the material they formed or due to a coating or a film applied to them. ATM I just applied the matte white plexi material to them.
    galaxy-0551.jpg
    galaxy-0552.jpg
    galaxy-0553.jpg
    Think they are a bit too short and wide. Using ratios of related shapes to get the sizes but that does not always work. Also 3rd image was only like 13% done so all the jpgy looking stuff is the incomplete bits. Odd how it makes this noise vs say mental ray which just gets sharper or finer in the grain.

    Figure I could always use a warp core somewhere else too. Granted it is pretty canon for each ship to have it's own design but meh.

    Also already noticed some errors in mine such as the door is fully domed. Where I have a flat face where that bar bisects the pull out tray. All the tape and markings also came later on in the set too so who knows what else might be different. Could swear the front was flat by some of the refs but that is the thing go by just a few meh images without looking at other meh images or just spending 2hrs scrolling through video and well heh. ATM I cannot be bothered to alter that part as again I wont be doing sets or anything at those distances to the camera so it likely wont be noticeable.

    ATM that one image is the only ref I have for those upper braces, short of referring to the white tube behind and the braces there which are similar. Spent enough time jogging through video to see if I can find any other shots from above or looking up.
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  • scifiericscifieric1122 Posts: 1,497Member
    That is an impressive amount of work, Madkoifish!
  • ViperViper1679 Posts: 717Administrator
    When I finish work today, I'll take a crack at those materials :)
  • BrandenbergBrandenberg1655 CaliforniaPosts: 1,937Member
    Wow, you are going ALL IN.
  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Fooling with materials. Adjusted the bar dai, so I had to redo the fittings on the brackets and added in the start of the larger braces. Will look at redoing the ribs next All lighting set up is to show a "off" state or standby.
    galaxy-0556.jpg
    galaxy-0557.jpg
    galaxy-0558.jpg



    Oddly enough once the braces are in those ribs look about right.
    Lizzy777Freak
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  • MadKoiFishMadKoiFish9714 Posts: 5,302Member
    Ok got all the braces in and cloned up what according to the tech manual and other refs is 12 decks of core including the injectors. I could not get the segments exact but it is close. One thing though is most cutaways (canon ones) show a unequal height from the intermix chamber. But all list decks 30~42 and deck 36 being where the intermix chamber is. So go fig. Gonna line it up to the ship itself and see how it fits but for now good enough. . . . Joke is this thing will probably be only a grey line at any decent distance.

    galaxy-0559.jpg
    galaxy-0560.jpg

    Also thinking those plain rectangles on the braces, might exist on the backside. I have no canon image proof of it but they seem to be some way of centering or being a repulsive force to keep the core from banging around on it's way out of the ship.

    Those out feed ports still bug the hell out of me as they would not fit through the port. Unless some huge clearance gap is going through 8 decks of ship. But hey seen some real world stupid in action and design so why not 400yrs into the future. :p
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