I don't know about that. According to him, he was apprehensive about doing SW because he didn't want to "get it wrong." (too bad he didn't feel that way about Star Trek, but I digress)
I finally played Jakku on Battlefront last night. It just looks like Tatooine with more Imperial garbage laying about. I don't know why they went and created a whole new planet whose filming location is Tunisia, where they also filmed Tatooine.
The above was intended as a joke, hence the ";)" , but truer words said in jest and all that. He did state that he wanted to save Star Trek by making it more "Star Warsy", and that he was more a fan of the 'Wars than the 'Trek which didn't earn him any Brownie points with the Trekkies, but obviously got the right attention from the right places seeing what came next.
With Jakku I can understand them going with somewhere different than Tatooine, after all that planet has already been done to death in both previous trilogies, and for a supposedly backwater world there do seem to be a lot of significant galaxy changing events occurring there. There also has to be more than one desert planet in the entire Star Wars universe, it gives them the opportunity to give us something new rather than retreading old ground. Being a desert planet keeps it familiar, but different. Oh, and it is filmed in Dubai I believe, so should feel quite different to Tunisia.
He did state that he wanted to save Star Trek by making it more "Star Warsy", and that he was more a fan of the 'Wars than the 'Trek which didn't earn him any Brownie points with the Trekkies, but obviously got the right attention from the right places seeing what came next.
Yeah, the dweebs at Paramount intentionally wanted someone who didn't like Star Trek or care anything about making good Trek. They wanted someone who could shake things up. And, given what I've read about what they want for the next one, they still haven't learned their lesson. Disney, (and Lucas) meanwhile, want directors who care about the source material for Star Wars and who will make movies that are true to what came before. At least, I hope that's the plan.
With Jakku I can understand them going with somewhere different than Tatooine, after all that planet has already been done to death in both previous trilogies, and for a supposedly backwater world there do seem to be a lot of significant galaxy changing events occurring there. There also has to be more than one desert planet in the entire Star Wars universe, it gives them the opportunity to give us something new rather than retreading old ground. Being a desert planet keeps it familiar, but different. Oh, and it is filmed in Dubai I believe, so should feel quite different to Tunisia.
Oh, it was filmed in Dubai? Hm. Well, the maps in Battlefront have a heavy Tatooine look to them. But then, that doesn't mean EA got it right. Though, the images and clips we've seen from the film do look a lot like Tatooine.
Obviously, there will be multiple desert planets and Tatooine is definitely getting old. However, the planet that I've seen in the clips doesn't look all that different from Tatooine. You can have multiple desert planets and have them look different. Geonosis is a desert planet and it looks way different from Tatooine.
Though, that does bring up an interesting point. Why do Star Wars planets tend to have only one climate and terrain type? You have desert planets, forest planets, ice planets, etc. Every one of those can be found on Earth. While it's nice to have diversity in your planets, it would probably be more realistic to have more diversity within the planets themselves.
Everyone assumed it was Tatooine at first until they got corrected by official sources, but I'm glad it is somewhere new. I'm sure when you see location come to life in the movie and with a bit of context the world will be able distinguish itself with it's own unique feel.
Planets with more than one climate? Preposterous! Come on people, we want to keep this scifi universe somewhat realistic and true to life....
The one climate worlds can be traced back to Star Wars' origins and influences, with the likes of the old Flash Gordon adventure serials. The world of Mongo was surrounded by one climate moons or realms depending on the version, forest moons, jungle moons and the like such as Arboria and Frigia, I guess it also helps from a narrative perspective in that it makes it very easy to distinguish what world you're on due to the distinct location climates as a visual shorthand. And if nothing else Star Wars is an intensely visual medium so the more economical George Lucas could be with that visual storytelling the better.
Can't fault you there. I was somewhat disappointed when I first saw the poster with the DeathStar wannabe in the background. Oh, so we're doing that again are we?
Yeah, but the Flash Gordon serials have bad science anyway. (still great fun, though) I mean, they were done in the '30s and '40s, back when nobody even really knew how to build a rocket. Star Wars started in the '70s, when science had advanced a wee bit.
What I *think* they're trying to do with the less originality is go with what made the original trilogy so popular: The Rebellion, or whatever they're called now, is fighting The Empire, or the First Order. I guess it made sense for them to once again go with a desert planet (though, that was done in the prequels as well) and a Death Star, etc. Though, I have to admit, that poster with the Death Star looking thing made me frown too. Though, it may not be a Death Star like the ones from the previous films. Who knows, it could be something totally different. Maybe it's a giant planet eating machine that turns into a massive robot. I mean, that's original, right? *snickers*
Fans? Probably not. Moronic studio execs? Probably. You know how the big studio movie industry is: Find something that works, use it to death, then find something else. :rolleyes:
Just saw this piece of steaming crap - it is TERRIBLE - this makes Phantom Menace look like Citizen Kane. I'm very disappointed. This film was a piece of fan-wank. Dreadful. Utterly amazed how bad this was. I didn't have high expectations at all but this film failed to meet even my extremely cautious expectations. When George Lucas raped our childhoods at least he used a generous amount of lube...
(Plus how had you seen it already when your post is time stamped at 01.23? I went to the midnight show and wasn't out until almost 3 am, it is over 2 hrs long?)
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but have to say I think you're in the minority here. This was my take on it....
Well that was a trip. All the accolades it has been getting are well founded. Have been up since 5 yesterday morning, and have just got in at 3 this morning after watching The Force Awakens and still feel wide awake after all that, what a rush, fear not, this movie delivers and then some.
Also coming out of there I've never seen the cinema so packed, they must have had it on in every screen or something. They really are aiming to make this the No.1 Box Office movie of the year, and on the strength of tonight's performance there's no reason why it shouldn't manage it. Awesome movie.
The scene in my local cinema at around 3am was just a sea of people, all buzzing. The Force has awakened indeed.
It was released here on the 16th so I did actually see it. But I really didn't like it at all - it felt like a movie based on a third rate Expanded Universe novel. Don't believe the hype - The Force Awakens is average at best. It is typical JJ Abrams - all style, zero substance. It's not a story being told, it is just a list of references and tropes from previous films. Just like Super 8. Just like Star Trek.
"Look, it's Han Solo!"
"Look it's a Death Star!"
"Look, it's the Millennium Falcon and it's breaking down again!"
And the villain was Anton Chigurh with a mask.
People are so scared of spoilers, but there's nothing to spoil, because you've seen every single part of this movie before.
The plot (if you can call it a plot) is basically an assembly of the most unreasonable, outrageous, intelligence-insulting coincidences I've ever seen.
Han Solo's character arc was clearly dictated entirely by the terms of Harrison Ford's contract and not the needs of the plot. He really phoned this one in from the 7th fairway.
And all the extremely dumb things you hated about the Prequels are here in spades. They have proved that they have effectively learned nothing from that debacle.
It proves once and for all that the people you least want making a new installment in a franchise are fans of that franchise because they lack all objectivity.
And please tell me but what is it with JJ Abrams and making space and time so trivial in his films? Hyperspace journeys across hundreds of thousands of light years take seconds and all planets and systems are visible with the naked eye from each other! It drives me NUTS.
I honestly cannot WAIT for Red Letter Media to tear this turkey a new one.
Have to disagree, there were similar themes from the past, but packaged in a new way, and the banter, emotional beats, it was all there in spades and spot on, it really did have the feel of coming home again. I will concede that that star system bit was a little weird, I'm not sure if that sequence was supposed to be another star system, or other planets within the same star system, but yeah I wasn't quite sure if that made sense on first viewing it, perhaps that'll be clearer on repeat viewings.
But with nitpicks like the length of time hyperspace travel took, you don't know how long those trips took, just because it didn't overtly show on screen that the trip took days or hours doesn't mean that it didn't.
I guessed a lot of what was going to happen without looking into spoilers due to my knowledge of the previous films in the franchise, but that didn't mean there were no surprises, and this movie's equivalent of the "I am your Father.." moment was telegraphed way ahead of when it happened if you read between the lines, and you could see it coming a mile off, but that did not rob that scene of its power, the cinema became completely eerily silent in anticipation and it was an emotional gut punch felt equally across the cinema.
I'm not sure what you were after from it, and how you felt so disappointed by the movie, but that is your opinion, the way the cinema was buzzing as everyone left after the movie tells a different story.
I'm a lifelong fan of Star Wars, and yet feel I can be objective about the franchise, as someone passionate about it I feel I can be its harshest critic as I know the thing inside out, and personally feel I know when something feels right, and when something feels wrong for the franchise (clearly only from my own opinion). And on first viewing this movie it felt overwhelmingly right. I'm sure when the dust settles and we get a bit of distance from it we'll start to nitpick and see plot holes as we always do, but I think the pure emotional journey this movie took you on felt like the old Star Wars again, but also somehow new as well.
Not read any reviews yet, avoided them until seeing the thing, but I've heard it has something like 95 on Rotten Tomatoes which sounds like a pretty unanimous glowing endorsement to me.
In other words JJ Abrams has done exactly he same thing as he did with Star Trek Into Darkness - a remake. Certain role functions have been changed and certain roles reversed but mostly it's the same goddamn story. I really expected more from this film. Star Trek Into Darkness was fine because we were expecting a reboot/remix because it takes place in an alternate reality. But the force awakens is Episode VII in a series. I wanted a new plot. I don't mind if it's full of homages, in-jokes and knowing winks at the audience but seriously, when every part of the plot is repeated in more or less the same order, that is a remake. It is lazy. I means this film gets ranked below the Prequels which, while they were bad stories at least they were new stories.
The Force Awakens is like a mediocre cover of an old song you love.
No, it certainly is NOTStar Trek Into Darkness which was pretty bad for the issues you outline. This does suffer from having a similar plot and tropes to the original, but it is very much it's own animal too, with fresh new characters, and intelligent use of the original cast. I don't feel I need to defend it though, I just think you should see it for yourself and formulate your own opinion.
No, it certainly is NOTStar Trek Into Darkness which was pretty bad for the issues you outline. This does suffer from having a similar plot and tropes to the original, but it is very much it's own animal too, with fresh new characters, and intelligent use of the original cast. I don't feel I need to defend it though, I just think you should see it for yourself and formulate your own opinion.
It's not as close a remake as Into Darkness but it is similar. You can compare them. Into Darkness was a hard remake, Force Awakens is a soft remake.
But seriously here's the very basic outline of ANH: Secret message is stored in a droid, which roams the desert until it finds the protagonist. Protagonist is forced to flee home by bad guys who are looking for the droid. Protagonist meets up with old man who goes with to a planet-destroying superweapon and helps destroy it, but is killed by the villain in the process. The rebel base is thus saved from destruction by the superweapon at the last second.
And here is the outline of The Force Awakens:
Secret message is stored in a droid, which roams the desert until it finds the protagonist. Protagonist is forced to flee home by bad guys who are looking for the droid. Protagonist meets up with old man who goes with to a planet-destroying superweapon and helps destroy it, but is killed by the villain in the process. The rebel base is thus saved from destruction by the superweapon at the last second.
Now I don't know about you but this seems incredibly lazy to me. The film is chock full of nostalgia and things designed to make fans feel all warm and fuzzy about classic Star Wars being back. And I approve of that, I really do. But that doesn't mean that every story beat has to be the same, too. I mean, let's hope Episode VIII isn't a a direct copy of the plot of The Empire Strikes Back, but somehow I suspect it will be because that is what the marketing drones at Disney will command. I just know already that there's gonna be an "I Am Your Father!" scene. I'll bet my nuts on it.
It's sad because they really could have done anything, absolutely ANYTHING with the freedom a 30 odd year break in the continuity allowed.
Mildly disappointed for reasons stated above. There was a level of predictability from scene to scene that gave an impression you were watching the film for the second or third time. A certain lack of emotional tension one would have expected at key pivot points in the story because you knew what was going to happen.
With that said, there are many possibilities for the story to expand as the new trilogy moves forward. JJ could screw it up but I'll wait to pass judgement. So as not to spoil it - I think TFA was a great foundation story for what is to come. The two principle characters are great, we will see how Poe works out but his small part was fun to watch and I want more. There was a lot of sincere joy in the theater I was at. I have a huge SW fan friend I went with and he had similar issues but still loved the film and plans to go again.
Regarding the other films, according to Lawrence Kasdan the remaining two (of the trilogy) will be quite different animals (so don't go in expecting a retread of Empire for the next one), even though they'll have a continuing through story, each director is going to bring their own unique thang to it apparently. So if you think the first one was too safe you should find the next ones more to your liking perhaps.
It is also worth noting that while the broad stroke plot lines are similar between Episodes IV & VII, the specific details are quite different. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying these similarities aren't an issue, probably the biggest issue I have with the movie, I'm just saying that taken on its own merits this is still a great SW film despite this, and should be seen before you make a judgement.
I can understand the relative lack of risk taking with the first one though, you're trying to achieve a very tricky alchemy of rekindling the sort of box office/pure cinematic gold that only comes once a generation, so just trying to get that formula right, and make the new Star Wars familiar, but new, and satisfy fans old and new alike is a great ask in and of itself, it has to essentially reestablish the franchise as a cinematic brand, and then lay down strong foundations for what comes next, and it does this in spades. Yes, it perhaps does retread a little too much familiar ground, but it also offers enough new and original material to not come across like a trite cover band version.
I also like how they're taking a bit of a cue from the EU with some of the choices being made, so they have not totally scrapped it, they have mined it for some of the good ideas that came out of that.
It was very much a thankless task JJ took on there, and boy done good in my opinion. He brought back the Star Wars we all know and love, and brought enough new to the table to leave us feeling pretty secure about the franchise's future, there definitely looks like there is more interesting story to be told in that galaxy far, far away...
Having watched the movie again, I did enjoy it more I admit, so my opinion of it has mellowed somewhat. But I still think it's problematic and definitely not on the same level as the original trilogy. But I can see the potential is there for the next two episodes to get a lot closer.
By the way, does Kylo's helmet weigh like 16 tons or something? The way it slams down with the sound of a sturdy boulder landing... I know it's dramatic but it took me out of the film eventually.
It's not as close a remake as Into Darkness but it is similar. You can compare them. Into Darkness was a hard remake, Force Awakens is a soft remake.
In what universe was Into Darkness a remake? That film has one scene lifted from TWOK and used two established Trek-characters (Khan and Marcus), but all in all it is it's own thing.
The Force Awakens, as good as it is, is almost a a beat-for-beat remake of Star Wars and parts of The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi with a few new characters added into it.
Posts
I finally played Jakku on Battlefront last night. It just looks like Tatooine with more Imperial garbage laying about. I don't know why they went and created a whole new planet whose filming location is Tunisia, where they also filmed Tatooine.
With Jakku I can understand them going with somewhere different than Tatooine, after all that planet has already been done to death in both previous trilogies, and for a supposedly backwater world there do seem to be a lot of significant galaxy changing events occurring there. There also has to be more than one desert planet in the entire Star Wars universe, it gives them the opportunity to give us something new rather than retreading old ground. Being a desert planet keeps it familiar, but different. Oh, and it is filmed in Dubai I believe, so should feel quite different to Tunisia.
I know. However, my reply was serious.
Yeah, the dweebs at Paramount intentionally wanted someone who didn't like Star Trek or care anything about making good Trek. They wanted someone who could shake things up. And, given what I've read about what they want for the next one, they still haven't learned their lesson. Disney, (and Lucas) meanwhile, want directors who care about the source material for Star Wars and who will make movies that are true to what came before. At least, I hope that's the plan.
Oh, it was filmed in Dubai? Hm. Well, the maps in Battlefront have a heavy Tatooine look to them. But then, that doesn't mean EA got it right. Though, the images and clips we've seen from the film do look a lot like Tatooine.
Obviously, there will be multiple desert planets and Tatooine is definitely getting old. However, the planet that I've seen in the clips doesn't look all that different from Tatooine. You can have multiple desert planets and have them look different. Geonosis is a desert planet and it looks way different from Tatooine.
http://www.starwars.com/databank/jakku
Though, that does bring up an interesting point. Why do Star Wars planets tend to have only one climate and terrain type? You have desert planets, forest planets, ice planets, etc. Every one of those can be found on Earth. While it's nice to have diversity in your planets, it would probably be more realistic to have more diversity within the planets themselves.
Planets with more than one climate? Preposterous! Come on people, we want to keep this scifi universe somewhat realistic and true to life....
The one climate worlds can be traced back to Star Wars' origins and influences, with the likes of the old Flash Gordon adventure serials. The world of Mongo was surrounded by one climate moons or realms depending on the version, forest moons, jungle moons and the like such as Arboria and Frigia, I guess it also helps from a narrative perspective in that it makes it very easy to distinguish what world you're on due to the distinct location climates as a visual shorthand. And if nothing else Star Wars is an intensely visual medium so the more economical George Lucas could be with that visual storytelling the better.
What I *think* they're trying to do with the less originality is go with what made the original trilogy so popular: The Rebellion, or whatever they're called now, is fighting The Empire, or the First Order. I guess it made sense for them to once again go with a desert planet (though, that was done in the prequels as well) and a Death Star, etc. Though, I have to admit, that poster with the Death Star looking thing made me frown too. Though, it may not be a Death Star like the ones from the previous films. Who knows, it could be something totally different. Maybe it's a giant planet eating machine that turns into a massive robot. I mean, that's original, right? *snickers*
Fans? Probably not. Moronic studio execs? Probably. You know how the big studio movie industry is: Find something that works, use it to death, then find something else. :rolleyes:
:argh:
:thumb:
(Plus how had you seen it already when your post is time stamped at 01.23? I went to the midnight show and wasn't out until almost 3 am, it is over 2 hrs long?)
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but have to say I think you're in the minority here. This was my take on it....
Well that was a trip. All the accolades it has been getting are well founded. Have been up since 5 yesterday morning, and have just got in at 3 this morning after watching The Force Awakens and still feel wide awake after all that, what a rush, fear not, this movie delivers and then some.
Also coming out of there I've never seen the cinema so packed, they must have had it on in every screen or something. They really are aiming to make this the No.1 Box Office movie of the year, and on the strength of tonight's performance there's no reason why it shouldn't manage it. Awesome movie.
The scene in my local cinema at around 3am was just a sea of people, all buzzing. The Force has awakened indeed.
:thumb:
"Look, it's Han Solo!"
"Look it's a Death Star!"
"Look, it's the Millennium Falcon and it's breaking down again!"
And the villain was Anton Chigurh with a mask.
People are so scared of spoilers, but there's nothing to spoil, because you've seen every single part of this movie before.
The plot (if you can call it a plot) is basically an assembly of the most unreasonable, outrageous, intelligence-insulting coincidences I've ever seen.
Han Solo's character arc was clearly dictated entirely by the terms of Harrison Ford's contract and not the needs of the plot. He really phoned this one in from the 7th fairway.
And all the extremely dumb things you hated about the Prequels are here in spades. They have proved that they have effectively learned nothing from that debacle.
It proves once and for all that the people you least want making a new installment in a franchise are fans of that franchise because they lack all objectivity.
And please tell me but what is it with JJ Abrams and making space and time so trivial in his films? Hyperspace journeys across hundreds of thousands of light years take seconds and all planets and systems are visible with the naked eye from each other! It drives me NUTS.
I honestly cannot WAIT for Red Letter Media to tear this turkey a new one.
But with nitpicks like the length of time hyperspace travel took, you don't know how long those trips took, just because it didn't overtly show on screen that the trip took days or hours doesn't mean that it didn't.
I guessed a lot of what was going to happen without looking into spoilers due to my knowledge of the previous films in the franchise, but that didn't mean there were no surprises, and this movie's equivalent of the "I am your Father.." moment was telegraphed way ahead of when it happened if you read between the lines, and you could see it coming a mile off, but that did not rob that scene of its power, the cinema became completely eerily silent in anticipation and it was an emotional gut punch felt equally across the cinema.
I'm not sure what you were after from it, and how you felt so disappointed by the movie, but that is your opinion, the way the cinema was buzzing as everyone left after the movie tells a different story.
I'm a lifelong fan of Star Wars, and yet feel I can be objective about the franchise, as someone passionate about it I feel I can be its harshest critic as I know the thing inside out, and personally feel I know when something feels right, and when something feels wrong for the franchise (clearly only from my own opinion). And on first viewing this movie it felt overwhelmingly right. I'm sure when the dust settles and we get a bit of distance from it we'll start to nitpick and see plot holes as we always do, but I think the pure emotional journey this movie took you on felt like the old Star Wars again, but also somehow new as well.
Not read any reviews yet, avoided them until seeing the thing, but I've heard it has something like 95 on Rotten Tomatoes which sounds like a pretty unanimous glowing endorsement to me.
Yeah, there IS new stuff there, too, but it is tucked in between the same basic plot line people saw in cinemas in 1977.
The film is good. But it is also very much a rehash of what's been done before.
The Force Awakens is like a mediocre cover of an old song you love.
It's not as close a remake as Into Darkness but it is similar. You can compare them. Into Darkness was a hard remake, Force Awakens is a soft remake.
But seriously here's the very basic outline of ANH: Secret message is stored in a droid, which roams the desert until it finds the protagonist. Protagonist is forced to flee home by bad guys who are looking for the droid. Protagonist meets up with old man who goes with to a planet-destroying superweapon and helps destroy it, but is killed by the villain in the process. The rebel base is thus saved from destruction by the superweapon at the last second.
And here is the outline of The Force Awakens:
Now I don't know about you but this seems incredibly lazy to me. The film is chock full of nostalgia and things designed to make fans feel all warm and fuzzy about classic Star Wars being back. And I approve of that, I really do. But that doesn't mean that every story beat has to be the same, too. I mean, let's hope Episode VIII isn't a a direct copy of the plot of The Empire Strikes Back, but somehow I suspect it will be because that is what the marketing drones at Disney will command. I just know already that there's gonna be an "I Am Your Father!" scene. I'll bet my nuts on it.
It's sad because they really could have done anything, absolutely ANYTHING with the freedom a 30 odd year break in the continuity allowed.
As for you haters, you might as well quit trying to be the Grinch Who Stole Star Wars. You haven't stopped Star Wars from coming, at all! :cool:
With that said, there are many possibilities for the story to expand as the new trilogy moves forward. JJ could screw it up but I'll wait to pass judgement. So as not to spoil it - I think TFA was a great foundation story for what is to come. The two principle characters are great, we will see how Poe works out but his small part was fun to watch and I want more. There was a lot of sincere joy in the theater I was at. I have a huge SW fan friend I went with and he had similar issues but still loved the film and plans to go again.
It is also worth noting that while the broad stroke plot lines are similar between Episodes IV & VII, the specific details are quite different. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying these similarities aren't an issue, probably the biggest issue I have with the movie, I'm just saying that taken on its own merits this is still a great SW film despite this, and should be seen before you make a judgement.
I can understand the relative lack of risk taking with the first one though, you're trying to achieve a very tricky alchemy of rekindling the sort of box office/pure cinematic gold that only comes once a generation, so just trying to get that formula right, and make the new Star Wars familiar, but new, and satisfy fans old and new alike is a great ask in and of itself, it has to essentially reestablish the franchise as a cinematic brand, and then lay down strong foundations for what comes next, and it does this in spades. Yes, it perhaps does retread a little too much familiar ground, but it also offers enough new and original material to not come across like a trite cover band version.
I also like how they're taking a bit of a cue from the EU with some of the choices being made, so they have not totally scrapped it, they have mined it for some of the good ideas that came out of that.
It was very much a thankless task JJ took on there, and boy done good in my opinion. He brought back the Star Wars we all know and love, and brought enough new to the table to leave us feeling pretty secure about the franchise's future, there definitely looks like there is more interesting story to be told in that galaxy far, far away...
:cool:
By the way, does Kylo's helmet weigh like 16 tons or something? The way it slams down with the sound of a sturdy boulder landing... I know it's dramatic but it took me out of the film eventually.
In what universe was Into Darkness a remake? That film has one scene lifted from TWOK and used two established Trek-characters (Khan and Marcus), but all in all it is it's own thing.
The Force Awakens, as good as it is, is almost a a beat-for-beat remake of Star Wars and parts of The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi with a few new characters added into it.